Fishing Forum

As all of you know, I rewired my Center Console last season and installed a new rocker switch panel. The install went very well and functions flawlessly. Now, after getting to the water a few times with a dead battery, and having to talk someone to drive their truck down the ramp to give me a jump, i've decided to upgrade my battery system.

Initially, I had decided to sell my boat and take the money and pay off my truck, but the hell with it. I just got the boat paid off, and I haven't had any hits on it with my Boat trader add, so I might as well keep it.

First of all, i'm pretty sure my single marine battery has kicked the bucket. It's old and done good up to this point, but I think it's time for a change. I was thinking about going to an optima battery.



The D31M has 1125 CCA at 32 degrees F. That's a lot of juice. It's price is what sucks, 229.00 for one. I was considering running two batteries, 1 for starting the motor only, and 1 for running the accessories. The only accessories I have is a VHF radio, Sonar, over head lights, and maybe an FM radio in the future. I probably wouldn't need that massive battery for my accessories, so I could get the smaller D34M at 199.00. But on that same note, it's only 30 bucks more.

I figure with a high speed battery like the optima, the battery life will be extended and they will be much more reliable than your standard deep cycle. Plus, I need the extra juice. My outboard, though fuel injected, is an EXTREMELY cold natured two stroke. So having the extra nuts is a must.

One major question I have is should I run the two batteries in Parallel, or should I leave them seperate?

Also, i'm looking at installing an on-board charging unit. The one i've found that has the best reviews is the Duel Pro XL. I found it at basspro.com.



It runs 164.99, and is a two bank supply for running duel batteries. The problem is, I don't know anything about an on board charger accept they make battery maintenance a whole lot easier. Just run a drop cord to the boat and plug it in. Doesn't get any better than that. A couple hours later, and the battery is charged. That alone would be worth the money to me. But, what about when the boat isn't pluged in and you're on the water? If you have two batteries, will the charger disperse the charge from the motors alternator evenly to each battery? How does that work? I know there is a unit availible that disperses the alternator charge from the motor to the second battery once the primary battery has reached full charge. I'm assuming that a standard on board charger has this same feature. Or atleast there should be a model that does.

So, i'll be upgrading to two batteries, and i'll be adding an on board charger. I hope to get some good comments or thoughts on the products i'm considering, and if there is anything better, please chime in. Thanks
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i would suggest that you get the same size battery,and throw in a switch

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that way you can change from 1 battery to another or run both if you need the power.and shut off all power.if you run just one,you will have a spare to switch over to
i would also go with a 2 bank maintainer,which will turn on and off as the batteries need a charge


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these pics came from boatersworld
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unless you have a 24 volt system and starter go with what tom is offering, If I remember right one way of hooking up the batteries makes it 24 volt while the other way remains 12 volt but doubles the amprage and either case you can burn out electronics and starter motors if it is not rated for the amperage of voltage....

I redid my small boat last year and rewired it, one battery goes to my electirc motor and one goes just to my electronincs lights ect...

I can pull start my motor, so if my battery goes dead its not a problem..

I realy like them solar trickle chargers, you do have to get auto turn offs and voltage regulator depending on wich modle charger you get...

I bought a solar charger for my deer feeder and set it out in october and pulled it a week before christmas and the battery was as charged as the day I put it out after 3 months.

my deer feeder has a built in regulator and turn off to keep from over charging the battery...

as far as battery life, look and see what the life of the battery is, bigger in not always better, batteries normaly run 3 year and 5 year so unless you are willing to put out the expence of replacing them I would look at the guarentee is on the battery, dont expect the battery to live much longer past that point, if it dose your living on barrowed time and end up with the situation your are experiencing now...

if you are booking charters then then the batteries are not so much of an issue... but if your not, its like driving a rolls royce back and forth to work every day down a dirt road...

you didnt mention what motor you are cranking over.. If your motor is that big it should have a generator on it that will charge the battery while it is running... if it dosnt you need to have that looked at...

mine is only a 15 horse johnson so it dosnt have a generator... and yes my battery dose go dead after a full day of fishing. I am concidering the solar charger for mine...
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i dont know where you came up with a 24 volt system

but this is for a 12 volt system.this switch allows you to run either 1 battery at a time or run both at the same time.you would run both if you have alot of electronics going such as radar,depth finder,am/fm radio,vhs radio,lights ect.this also gives the option of shutting off all power if some problem arises
they do make switches for a 24 volt and 36 volt systems,but the prices start in the $500 range
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when you run batteries in line the voltage adds up.

say you have a flash light with 6 "1.5" volt batteries, the total voltage is 9 volts.

so if you take two twelve volt batteries set both batteries with negitive on the left, run a jumper across from negitive to positive from one battery to the other. you can take a voltage tester and test the un conected post and you will have 24 volts.

that is an inline conection.... same with the flash light every thing is in line...

but with a voltage regulator as you are sugesting that would handle the amprage concerns... and is the best way to go...

all the old cars and trucks running on generators and not altranators have voltage regulators in addition to the fuse box...

you probably have seen them on the old farm tractors that are still in opperation after 50 years.

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I havent seen a twin or triple engine hookup yet. I havent a clue as to if they start on seperate starters or do they all start up at once...

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I am still wondering why his battery is going dead unless it is just not taking a charge like he says or is the motor running off the battery or is the generator dead or have an interuption some where in the wireing?

I fiture its either one of those or he has a motor that dosnt have a generator.... either way that is a deffenate need to know for him or any one else for that matter...
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your right dave,but the switch is for a parallel connection,in turn it hook up positive to positive,negative to negative=12 volts,bryon also mentioned that his battery was old,so it was about time









. Series Connections

Let's begin in Figure 1 with a simple box model showing the positive and negative terminals to represent the physical battery. We'll use this to relate to the physical connections between the batteries that you would use to construct a battery pack.




Figure 1: Single Battery Physical Model & Schematic Symbol[/b]



Figure 2: Batteries Connected in Series[/b]

Figure 2 shows two 12-volt batteries connected in series. The important things to note about a series connection are: 1) The battery voltages add together to determine the battery pack voltage. In this example the resulting pack voltage is 24 volts. 2) The capacity of the battery pack is the same as that of an individual battery. This assumes that the capacities of the individual batteries are the same. In fact, this is a must. Do not mix and match different size batteries in the same battery pack.

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3. Parallel Connections



Figure 3: Batteries Connected in Parallel [url "http://batterytender.com/images/largeseries3.gif"](Click to Enlarge)[/url]

Figure 3 shows two 12-volt batteries connected in parallel. The important things to note about a parallel connection are: 1) The battery pack voltage is the same as the voltage of the individual battery. This assumes that the individual battery voltages are the same. In fact, this is an absolute must. Do not mix and match different battery voltages in the same battery pack. In this example the battery pack voltage is 12 volts which is exactly the same as each of the individual 12-volt batteries. 2) The capacity of the battery pack is the sum of the capacities of the individual batteries. Again, make sure that all of the batteries are the same size, that is that they have the same amp-hour capacity.

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4. Series/ Parallel Connections

There are many ways to connect a group of batteries in both series and parallel at the same time. This is common practice in many battery power appliances, particularly in electric vehicles and large UPS systems where the battery packs require large voltages and amp-hour capacities. It is not uncommon to have battery packs with several hundred volts and several hundred amp-hours.

Just to get an idea of how these connections can be made, we'll look at two examples, with 4 batteries each, using 12 volt, 20 Ah batteries. In each of the examples, the 4 batteries are identified as A, B, C, and D. Example 1, shown in Figure 4, has 2 pairs of series connected batteries joined in a single parallel connection. In this type of arrangement, we refer to each pair of series connected batteries as a "string". Batteries A and C are in series. Batteries B and D are in series. The string A and C is in parallel with the string B and D. Notice that the total battery pack voltage is 24 volts and that the total battery pack capacity is 40 amp-hours.



Figure 4: Batteries Connected in Series / Parallel: Example 1 [url "http://batterytender.com/images/largeseries4.gif"](Click to Enlarge)[/url]

Example 2, shown in Figure 5, has 2 pairs of parallel-connected batteries joined in a single series connection. Batteries A and B are in parallel. Batteries C and D are in parallel. The parallel combination A and B is in series with the parallel combination C and D. Again, the total battery pack voltage is 24 volts and that the total battery pack capacity is 40 amp-hours.



Figure 5: Batteries Connected in Series / Parallel: Example 2 [url "http://batterytender.com/images/largeseries5.gif"](Click to Enlarge)[/url]

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I've got a master battery switch on my boat already. I stole this picture from when I did the boats re-wireing job:




But as you can see, it's not designed but for a single battery input. You're all right on your assesments of how to parallel and cross batteries. I have done this before, I just didn't know how well it would work in a marine application. Running the batteries parallel keeps the batteries at 12V, but the Amp output is increased, which is not an issue.

Dave, Though i'm not running charter out of my boat, I still need the extra performance and durability out of my equipment. Hints the reason I always try to use the best equipment when I tackle a job. If I were putt putting around a lake or river, I wouldn't be so concerned. But, I really beat this boat in the ocean, and rarely turn back unless the water gets scarey big. I use my boat quite often as well, so it takes a constant walloping. Settling for equipment that will work for the average recreational angler just won't cut.

It's my understanding that the Optima batteries will give me the performance I hoping for, and the on board charger and use of dual batteries will keep me from arriving at the dock with a dead battery. The cold months are infamous for killing a battery on the way. I wish I had a 10 dollar bill for every time a cold night has killed the battery quicker than the trickle charger can keep it up.

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This guy up there, only 39.99 at boatersworld.com. That's a good deal. That takes care of the paralleling issue and the charging issue. I'm going to pick one up here in the next week or two. Good looking Tom. Now, all I have to do is pick up a couple batteries and an onboard charger. That will set me back about 500 bucks, but I shouldn't ever have issues again. Especially since i've rewired the boat. Oh, I think i've got to replace my VHF too. BLAH!

Thanks for the input guys! I'll do this one like I did the last one and take pictures. Thanks
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ya pictures are the way to go,,, kind a like that santy clause comercial,, "give him a wooden rocking horse"

when some one starts talking two batteries I dont know if they are running a big or twins outboards, 350 chevy big block or a desel engin.

I know there is one desel that takes the 350 chevy to start it, at least that is the way it used to start, Dont ask me wich one I cant remember, I am lucky enough to remember it takes one engin to start the other.... LOL

I couldnt begin to tell ya what starts them hydrofoils, aside from a large can of either... [laugh]

as for your boat being a work horse and deserves the best you can give it... safe is always better than sorry or I wished I had-a....[]

I am easily these daze, to much info stored in a scrambled brain...[]

if this helps to understand my possision, I was 40 before I realized that in the poem mary had a little lamb, it didnt have fleas as white as snow it was a flease..[laugh] Ya I am half deef too...[]
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thanks for the diagrams,

you may want to concider making a single post with your diagrams on your board and lable it battery series or multiple battery hook up or what ever it is called.... its an excilent resorce..[cool]
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I think i'm getting those same symtoms. LOL

Na, as for my motor, it's just a vicious cold natured [url "mailto:bast@#d"]bast@#d[/url]. I've litterly killed a battery trying to crank it on a cold morning. This was a charged battery now. LOL Nothing wrong with the motor, just under-batteried. The battery couldn't turn the motor quick enough for it to fire in the cold weather. A lot of the big 2 strokes are like that, even the fuel injected ones like mine. I think i'm just under powered in the battery department all the way around. It's an upgrade that has long been over due. Like I said before though, it's sucks because it's an expensive one. But, I can't over look it. Batteries are critical, especially with the larger and newer motors of today. My boat is no exception.

And when I say I "beat the hell out of my boat," I mean it. LOL A lot of days where most people would turn around and go home, I push on through the wake. Nothing much more to say about that.

None the less, i'll remain in the planning stage until I can get the fundage to get started. I'm always up for suggestion. Thanks again[cool]
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up here in the northern states we have special batteries designed spicificaly for cold weather.

do your self a favor, start your motor with your water caps on the water pump, after you get it started and running pull the positive cable loose from the battery and see if the motor dies. do it only for a second or two, you will know right away if the motor is running off the battery insted of generating it own current.

If it dose you have a problem with your generator or voltage regulator... Do it for your own self asurance, a motor that is drawing a charge insted of generating a charge will kill new batteries.. and will eventualy burn out the starter motor and the electronic brain...

My dads 65 murk did that, and when the motor finaly took the forever nap it was in the middle of the detroit river in the shipping lane. Me and my little brother was fishing from shore and we saw a boat trying to paddle with a net to get out of the way of an on comming freighter. we couldnt tell that it was our dads boat with little sister in the boat...

when the freighter whent by you could see the little water craft lifting up in the wake of the ocean bound ship, it lifted the little boat up a good 20 feet. thought for sure the little boat was a gonner..

like I said we didnt know it was dad untill about 6 hours later when we see them getting twoed back to the harbor. 4 hours late...

any way, they had to pull the flywheel to replace the electronic brain then track down what burned out the brain, turned out to be the generator...

turned out dad knew the motor wasnt charging the battery, and that was why he had a spare battery in the boat.. He didnt think it was that big of a deal because it took 4-5 hours to drain the battery, that was untill the deal went bad...

after that he takes real good care of his boat motors and like you said dont skimp on the things that could be the differance between going back to shore or meeting Davey Jones in person.... and I dont mean one of the monkeys...
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I WOULD GO FOR THE TWO BANK CHARGER AS WELL. I KEEP THE BOAT PLUGGED IN 24/7 AND IT'S READY TO GO. THE MOTOR CHARGES THE AFT BATTERY WHILE UNDER WAY.
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This system is great no worry about dead batteries ever.
[url "http://www.stayncharge.com/"]http://www.stayncharge.com/[/url]
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I actually have a battery charge indicator on my boat, as well as my sonar giving me a display of how much juice is being distributed to my battery. So, I know for a fact the alternator is working. Once I get the boat cranked, it charges right up via the motor. It's just keeping the juice in it during the ride, and having enough power left in it to actually crank the motor when I arrive to the dock. LOL What a pain. [crazy]
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I was wondering if there was something that allowed the vehicle alternator to charge it. LOL, I just couldn't find it. However, with a stock alternator, I wouldn't attempt to use this gadget, even though I know it would work. It won't say it, but I know for a fact that the extra load on the alternator will shorten it's life. And alternators aren't cheap for my truck. If I did that, I would have to upgrade my alternator to something much larger.

The thing I like about the 2 bank on-board charging system is all you do is plug it in and forget about it. That is so freaking awesome! half the reason I neglect my batteries now is because i'm lazy and it's a pain in the butt to get the charger on the batteries. I don't have a problem running a drop cord to the boat, that's easy. Like Gregg was saying, he just plugs his in and leaves it. They are always ready to go. That's what i'm talking about. [cool]

Maybe the IRS will be good to me this year and I can knock this project out pretty soon. []
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Don't forget to unplug it. Saw a fella in VT that dragged his cord all the way to the boat ramp.[shocked] Wanted to fish real bad I guess.[]
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LOL, that was probably an expensive mistake. Even if just the drop cord got ruined, that's 50 bucks. The on board chargers are averaging around 150.00 and on up. I'll make sure and keep that in mind. [] I've got to gather the money to actually make the upgrade first though.
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lol,hope he put the plug in .that could have been a double bad.
i put the cord so its over the of the trailer so it reminds me.that old saying out of sight out of mind
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Out of sight, out mind is so true. I'm a habitual brain farter, and if I don't actually see what I need to do or remember, i'll forget. LOL I'd tie a string around my finger, but i'd get annoyed and take it off before time for me to need to remember what it's for. I might better add the charger, batteries, and drop cord to the home owners insurance eh? LMAO!!!!!!! [laugh]

That's just like my truck keys. I have a single key for my truck, that's it. I've been in and out of Lowes at least a dozen times in the last month, and never got a spare key made. It's just a matter of time before that bites me in the fanny. I actually remembered a couple times, and was just too lazy to wait for the key to be made. [unimpressed]
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Sounds like to me you need a seperate electrical system, one just for the motor. then an electrical supply for your other electronics.. you are running more than your generating...

you need something that dosnt exist...
"A generator that mounts to the bottom of your boat with a propeller. This way when you are moving on down the drift you are generating current on a seperate electrical system..
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