I found this article interesting.
Is it a measure to maximize hydropower revenue?
or
Improve the habitat for endangered fish?
[url "http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=87933157&ft=1&f=1001"]http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=87933157&ft=1&f=1001[/url]
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What they are doing help or dose nothing but drop the lake 3'to 4' they have been doing this for five years or more...
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Article says "It's the third artificial test flood in the past 12 years."
So you are saying they do this more often?
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They have to test as they have no idea whats going on.
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Ever wonder why Lee's Ferry has gone down hill.
They release water to simulate historic flooding to build sand bars down river. They had good results from the first two floods but the third reduced C.R. chubs populations.
I think it's a waste of time and money. The first issue is water temps are not similar to pre-dam temps. The second is there is no new sand being added to the system. All the normal sand is being dumped into Powell instead of distributing throughout the river system.
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One thing to note is that in a "natural river" every spring the river blows out, and the eddys are where the sand is deposited. These become the lovely beaches the rafter crowd likes to camp on. Without the floods, over time the sand all blows back in to the river and washes downstream. By flooding they hope to renovate the beaches and sand bars that are home to some of the species in question. They also hope to provide nice sandy beaches for people to enjoy.
We have experienced the same issue on the Snake River in Idaho, but there can be no flooding to renovate the beaches, as it would wash towns away. We call it progress.
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It doesnt make sense to blast sediment when its all backing up behind the dam, there is no flow of sediment from up river, so they are essentially scouring a big hole at the bottom of the dam and not moving enough turf to make a difference.
And when the lake is already 60 feet below full pool, it would make more sense to test this theory in a year when Powell is not struggling to refill.
Im sure SUWA had a say in this somewhere-
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Yes they have dumped water from Powell and the Gorge before but only do it at Powell now, it is not for generating elc...
The bird bee and bunny lovers are saying it helps the chubs and suckers in the river...
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[#0000ff]Supposedly it is to help restore the humpback chub...another endangered species which cannot live in the changed ecosystem below the dam. But, they keep spending a bunch bucks to keep proving that they can't do it. Kinda like the June sucker program.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]The 
thing is that every time they push the flush lever they wash out the trout and trout food. Totally scour out the gravel and aquatic growth in the Lee's Ferry area. Just about the time it starts to return to good fishing again, they flush it again.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]The stripers in Lake Mead probably appreciate the extra water and the fresh trout appetizers too.[/#0000ff]
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Yes its the same people who say we should not fish or hunt as well....
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Who's to say that the deposited sediment at the bottom of the dam is not escaping during this "flush out"!!! Do they have underwater camera's there? Maybe they should concentrate some effort to "dredge/pump" out some of that sediment that rests' up against the dam!!! I do agree that they should wait until the water level is higher, but I think they plan these around the time that they expect the water level to increase by a certain amount like this year with the big winter we have had. Long story short, all we can do is stand behind our opinions and let the scientists' do their work (whatever that may be), that is what they get paid the "big bucks" for!!! Sitting here on a fishing forum and saying that it is a waste of time and money isnt going to do anything. If the scientists' find out a way to "help" the eco system below the dam then good on them. At least that will keep the "Eco Friendly Rioters" off their back for a while!!! Again, just my opinion!!!
TS
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To suddenly open the gates causing high water conditions and say we are re-establishing beaches etc, the dirt has to come from somewhere, and if not much of it is coming from the buildup behind the dam, where else would the sediment come from but in the drainage area at the bottom of the dam? This is why I say they are likely scouring a hole at the bottom of the dam. I wish I knew how much sediment actually moves through the shoots from the back of the dam, and you're right, they would likely have to dredge it to really get it moving.
I also know that a lot of "science" is politically motivated, which is why I said SUWA probably had a big say in the release of the water. Also does anyone think SUWA would be against lowering the water level in Powell even more to strengthen their case for dam removal by saying Powell will never refill since its so low?
There is a lot of money spent on junk science that is politically motivated, and when something seems like a horrednous waste of money and resources we have an obligation to question it.
I would like to really think that the drain is helpful, but what did they find the last 2 times they did this experiment? I would be curious to hear if the outcome was successful or if the beaches simply eroded after a few months of normal water fluctuations.
I defintely have my opinions band I hope the scientists know what they are doing, but it seems to me that the timing is really bad.
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[cool][#0000ff]Lake Powell is a LOOOOOOOONG lake. Very little of the silt that comes in from the rivers stays in the water long enough to deposit next to the dam. I have never seen muddy water at Wahweap except after big rain storms dumped in some mud from the closes small washes. [/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]The water that sucks out through the turbines comes from the bottom and any current they generate probably pulls any accumulated sediment through with it. The water being released right now is not from the bottom of the lake, but through big flood gates higher up in the water column. No chance of pulling sediment through there.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]Some sediment comes in downriver, mainly from the Little Colorado River and some seasonal side channels. But, not like in the old days when the river was "too thick to drink and too thin to plow".[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]People I know in the fish guiding and rafting business mostly say the same thing. It ain't like it used to was and it is getting worse instead of better. Every time they flush the river, they LOSE sand along with shifting it around. Former beaches are gone and present ones are much smaller.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]I had to laugh last night while watching the news and they interviewed one of the head "scientists". His input was mostly that they don't really know what they learned from the first floodings...and that this one will only help confirm what they think they might possibly have done. Definitely no signs of positive long-lasting effects from any of the previous efforts, but they will keep trying.[/#0000ff]
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All that schooling and no common sense.
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have you hit yer head the water at whaweep is as clear as bear lake. ya couldnt fill a bucket with sediment from the enlet. this is just to satisfy,the enviromental wakos,who gives a rats ass about the hump back chub. thank god these wakos werent around when the dinousares were having a bad time. hell were in a drought the lake is 100 ft below full pool, keep as much water as possible.like all the water going out to the lake now. none going into willard. next thing you will here is it got warmer faster than we thought,all the water evaporeted.fill the lakes then dump it into the crapper know as the great salt lake good lord i fill bettter.[sly]
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After carefull consideration I think everyone is right. Screw the Eco-People. I would much rather see Lake Powell full then a sand bar on the Colorado River that I do not visit at all!!!![laugh] I have always asked the question about why we let so much water out of the area reservoirs when 80% of it ends up in the crappie Salt Lake. I understand we need it for counsumption and what not, but why not just let these lakes fill to capacity and then the water we use from consumption will be the stuff that comes over the spill ways???!!!
TS
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[size 1]"I have always asked the question about why we let so much water out of the area reservoirs when 80% of it ends up in the crappie Salt Lake. I understand we need it for counsumption and what not, but why not just let these lakes fill to capacity and then the water we use from consumption will be the stuff that comes over the spill ways???!!!"[/size]
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[size 1]The purpose of reservoirs is not to provide maximum water for the growing of fish, it is to store surplus water during the high run-off periods so that the water is available for use throughout the year. Also, if your recommendation was followed we would experience flooding nearly every year, because the reservoirs would already be filled to capacity when the spring run off flowed into them.[/size]
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kentofns, they would not no what to say. There always in the experiment mood. Only they can't come up with any answers. Always speculating like the weather people.Nice job just speculating, that way there not responsible for anything.
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[#0000ff]Supposedly it is to help restore the humpback chub...another endangered species which cannot live in the changed ecosystem below the dam. But, they keep spending a bunch bucks to keep proving that they can't do it. Kinda like the June sucker program.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]The thing is that every time they push the flush lever they wash out the trout and trout food. Totally scour out the gravel and aquatic growth in the Lee's Ferry area. Just about the time it starts to return to good fishing again, they flush it again.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]The stripers in Lake Mead probably appreciate the extra water and the fresh trout appetizers too.[/#0000ff][/reply]
Actually, there is nothing better for the trout population and the fishery as a whole than this blowing out. What happens to the fishery is this: 1) fish love water and the increase in water also increases the amount of food available for fish--especially terrestrials 2) the washing out will destroy spawning habitat which should help reduce overpopulated rainbow trout and allow trout that do survive a bigger share of the available food which, in turn, will help rainbows grow larger and quicker 3) the flood will kill many juvenile and some adult fish...again, this is a positive in a fishery where too many fish exist.
All trout fishermen who enjoy Lee's Ferry should be thrilled with the results...unfortunately, too many fishermen are simply misinformed and ignorant with such things...and, as a result, we see a lot of dumb comments like the ones in this thread!
My father repeatedly speaks of the heydays of the Colorado River and bemoans the impact of stable flows upon this river and the totally reduced productivity that has resulted...we should be condoning these types of floods to occur more often as trout fishermen!
As for the fishermen of Lake Powell, any reduction in lake levels caused by this flooding can only help bass by also allowing habitat to grow and then later be flooded...this can only benefit bass, crappie, bluegill, and other game fish populations. For fishermen, this is a win/win situation...but, it is funny how many mock what they don't understand!
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One more thing: Less water will be released from Glen Canyon Dam during the rest of the year to make up for the water released over the next several days. In the end, all of the river water allotments will be exactly the same. Lake Powell would have been no higher or more full if this experiment weren't being conducted.
And, what if the experiment doesn't work? What are we out? As far as trout goes, nothing....
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