Fishing Forum

I just found out that tonight the US Fish and Wildlife will be having a public hearing regarding closing Walcott to ALL boats. If you ever fish, boat, or enjoy Walcott State park you need to make it to tonights meeting in Pocatello. the meeting is at the Red Lion Hotel and it starts at 6:30pm. This is legit, if there is any way you can make it please be there. If we don't have an overwelming attendence it is very likely that we will not be fishing there anymore.

Word is they want to help the pelicans reproduce with out disturbing them. I think they are doing just fine......
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There are too many pelicans. I think they are an invasive species. I don't remember them being in Idaho at all when I was a kid. First time I remember seeing them was at Island Park Res in the 1980's
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I said after Lake Lowell it would be a domino effect. Looks like it is coming true.

Using the pelicans as an excuse is BS. They're nowhere near being on the endangered list. Just like the western grebe on Lowell. They are on the least concern list along with us humans. BTW the white pelican is also on the least concern list.
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We did not have pelicans in Idaho 40 years ago. This is a made up cause to create more financing for the departments that protect them. This is a disgusting. misuse of Idaho resources.
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wish i would have seen this yesterday [frown] so did anyone attend that can shed some light on the meeting?
I don't understand why there considering doing this as they have been trying to eradicate a few of the birds

The Idaho [url "http://www.physorg.com/tags/fish/"]Fish[/url] and Game Commission in May approved a five-year plan to kill and haze American white pelicans in southeastern Idaho to protect sport fish and Yellowstone cutthroat trout populations. The plan calls for shooting some pelicans and applying oil to eggs to suffocate the embryos.
Pelicans are protected under federal law, so anything to cut their numbers requires U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service approval.
"We didn't feel the management plan had enough data in it right now to issue the permits required," said Brad Bortner, the Fish and Wildlife Service's migratory birds chief in Portland, Ore. on Wednesday.
Idaho wildlife officials took exception to characterizations of their proposal as a "pelican eradication program" by wildlife officials in Utah
"Absolutely not," said Jeff Gould, chief of Idaho's Bureau of Wildlife. "It's a management plan for pelicans, with the primary goal of reducing impacts to fish."
Gould expects to meet with federal Fish and Wildlife officials later in July to discuss their questions about Idaho's plan, as well as what additional scientific justification will be needed to obtain permits to proceed with management of the big birds.
Pelicans at the Blackfoot Reservoir colony have increased from 1,400 breeding birds in 2002 to 2,400 breeding birds in 2008, while a colony on Lake Walcott on the Snake River increased from about 400 breeding birds in 2002 to more than 4,000 breeding birds.
The agency's plan calls for reducing bird numbers by more than half, while still maintaining a viable population: 700 breeding birds at the Blackfoot Reservoir and 2,100 in Lake Walcott.
Two Fish and Wildlife Service offices - in Oregon and in Utah - panned Idaho's plan, saying that implementing the proposal would undo pelican conservation accomplishments from the last 25 years and any damage could be irreversible.
"Given the conservation status assigned by Idaho and other western states, and given the threats to the species, we believe it is unwise to begin a pelican eradication program," wrote Larry Crist, Fish and Wildlife Service's Utah field supervisor.

"Lethal take of pelicans would not be reversible and it could take years for the local population to recover," he wrote.
Federal managers suggested Idaho instead construct in-stream structures, permanent wire arrays and plant streamside vegetation to discourage pelicans that prey on Yellowstone cutthroat trout, especially in low water years when those swimming upstream are particularly vulnerable.
They also said Idaho's plan failed to take into account how historic water levels in the Blackfoot Reservoir played a role in reducing Yellowstone cutthroat trout numbers. More than 4,700 spawning cutthroats were counted in 2001; the number dropped to just 14 in 2005.
But federal officials pointed out the crash following 2001 came after river discharges during spawning, while trout increased substantially in 2008 after several years of higher river flows.
Pelicans likely arrived in Idaho before white settlers, though the creation of reservoirs for farm irrigation like on the Blackfoot River in the early 1900s produced ideal island habitat for the ground-nesting birds. Some anglers complain the birds eat too many sport fish, though Fish and Game's own plan concedes 90 percent of their diet is composed of non-game fish like chubs.
Idaho can continue to haze pelicans that may be eating cutthroat trout. And for a fourth year, Fish and [url "http://www.physorg.com/tags/wildlife/"]Wildlife[/url] gave state managers permission to kill up to 50 pelicans, though only for scientific analysis of things like their diet, not to control their numbers.

another story


HN MILLER - Associated Press Published: May 16, 2010 at 9:25 AM MDT
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BOISE, Idaho (AP) — The badgers bailed. The skunk skedaddled. The pelicans persevere.

In April, the state Department of Fish and Game put five predators — three badgers, two skunks — on an island in the Blackfoot Reservoir in southeastern Idaho in a bid to keep American white pelicans from nesting there.

The agency blames the big birds for eating too many fish, including sensitive Yellowstone cutthroat trout, as well as stocked hatchery-raised trout coveted by anglers.

But two badgers outfitted with radio collars now appear to have swum to the mainland. There's no sign of the third badger, which had no collar. And only one skunk with a radio collar remains on Gull Island. The other has disappeared.

Mark Gamblin, Fish and Game's regional supervisor for southeastern Idaho, concedes enlisting skunks and badgers to control pelicans has been a bit of a disappointment, at least so far.

"This is exactly what adaptive management is: You try something, you learn something from it and decide what the best approach to take is," Gamblin said.

Pelicans in two colonies in southeastern Idaho, one on the Blackfoot Reservoir and the other on the Snake River's Lake Walcott, have tripled to about 7,000 birds since 2002. Idaho wants to reduce the flock to 700 birds at the Blackfoot Reservoir and 2,100 at Lake Walcott by 2013.

In 2009, Fish and Game proposed shooting pelicans and oiling their eggs to keep them from hatching.

That angered some who like the big birds. And the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service, the federal agency that manages migratory birds under a 1918 law, appeared likely to shoot down Idaho's proposed lethal measures after calling them an "eradication program."

As a result, Gamblin's agency decided to unleash the badgers and skunks.

That the predators bolted isn't exactly a surprise.

A badger's home range is tens or even hundreds of times the size of 6-acre Gull Island. A skunk's range may be 1,200 acres, too.

Both are swimmers.

A radio collar from one of the badgers is currently sending a "mortality signal" from an area that scientists believe is located on the mainland. That means the collar isn't moving. Until it's collected, Gamblin won't know if the animal is dead or has just shed its collar.

"It's a valuable collar, we need to retrieve it," he said.

Biologists who fly the reservoir regularly haven't picked up the signal of two additional collars, meaning the badger and skunk that wore them have likely wandered beyond the one-to-two-mile signal range.

Gamblin said spring snow flurries delayed pelican nesting this year, so the birds are still arriving to lay their eggs.

On Willow Island, a second island in the Blackfoot Reservoir, the state agency has also fenced off about half the pelican nesting habitat. But even that's no guarantee of reducing pelican numbers, because the adult birds might just crowd into nesting habitat that remains.

"It's been effective at preventing nesting activity within the fence," Gamblin said. "We may learn — we don't know yet — that the birds just pack into a tighter area."
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have never been to walcott. i have been told it is a very good smallmouth fishery. hate to hear about the lake being attacked over pelicans. i hate pelicans. i think they do a ton of damage to our fisheries. i have seen them gorging themselves with fish ! wish we could just shoot them on site !
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That's what I don't understand what this is all about. They were telling us that they were going to start destroying nesting areas and eggs and now all of a sudden they want to protect the nesting areas and eggs?!?!?

Sounds like typical government mumbo-jumbo, flip-flopping to me.
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Bob, the state wants to reduce nesting and numbers of pelicans. The feds - US Fish & Wildlife Service - want to protect them. The USFWS has been taken over by radical environmentalists, who are only interested in endangered species, preservation and indoctrinating our kids. The hunters and fishermen come last in their eyes.
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I understand them 'pretty white birds' only eat approx. 7 pounds of fish a day - per bird!
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Triple S is all I have to say for the birds.

Enviros make no sense what so ever. Remove dams to help fish out, and then turn around and protect birds that eat 6-10 lbs a day of fish. What it comes down to is cash and how much money they can line their pockets with for getting behind certain movements. Wolves was another one.
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Good News!!!!

It sounds like like are going to leave everything the same. They said they are mandated every so many years to have a public meeting to receive input on the managment of the refuge. Looks like we dodged the bullet this time.

Tight lines........
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That's good to hear. The part is most of the people moving into idaho are not interested in hunting and fishing so eventually they are going to win out.

One reason why our bass club folded this year is the fact that not enough new fishermen to help keep it afloat. Young people are not interested as they rather sit behind a computer or game console rather then get out in the great outdoors. I see a very future for us outdoorsmen.
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Good deal sure would hate to loose that area it produces many fine bass and trout as well as being close enough to do some evening fishing trips after work
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[quote Bmarsh]Triple S is all I have to say for the birds.

Enviros make no sense what so ever. Remove dams to help fish out, and then turn around and protect birds that eat 6-10 lbs a day of fish. What it comes down to is cash and how much money they can line their pockets with for getting behind certain movements. Wolves was another one.[/quote]


Most of the environmentalists in the FWS do not care about the animals they say they want to protect. They view these "endangered" species as tools. Tools to control land and access to it. If you look at the ideology of the environmentalists, for the most part, they are Godless people who have replaced God with earth/animal worship. They truly believe that they need to kick us off the land to "preserve" these species. Wolves, pelicans, whatever, they are just tools for the environmentalists to use and arguing with these people is like arguing about religion. There is too much emotion in it. The only way to beat these very patient control mongers is to educate the masses using real data, statistics, facts...etc. It is time for us to become better informed about this stuff so we don't become duped by their hidden agendas.
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Environmentalists are hypocrites. If they were true environmentalists, they would commit hari-kari for the good of the earth and animals. This would ensure the continuation of the species they are trying to protect by providing more room for said species to grow and prosper.

Incorporated in their name is the word mentalist, does this mean they're mental cases???[cool]
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What club were you in Bob?
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I was president of the Gem State Hookers. The club had been in existence since 1987. I've had an ad in the Statesman for the last 10+ years in the outdoors section. Members came and went thru the years. We kept the membership to no more than 25 members to keep it small so friendships could develop. I've been in clubs that had 50+ members and didn't know half of them. The economy was the final straw, I suppose plus people moved on to other things.

Being retired, I would like to see a midweek club so you wouldn't half to fight the weekend crowd. I did belong to Midnight Bassmasters. They fished on Wed starting at 4 PM to dark which limited it to close by lakes but I would prefer one that started at dawn to 3 PM. If most of the members were retired or had midweek days off, you could go to lakes that were further away.
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I remember Gem State Hookers. They formed back when I used to tourney fish. I started in 1983 and fished until about 1996 or so. I fished with Intermountain Bass.
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What's with all the environmentalist hate? You have to remember that it's not a unified hive mind group with a single agenda. Overall, I think the movement has had a positive impact on outdoors enthusiasts.

In fact, I think we need them, and I find it that we aren't more unified. There are a lot more of them, and I'm sure we could get more accomplished against the 'enemy' that both groups share. Namely, the industries and corporations that would happily poison the earth, air and water, chop down every last tree, and kill off any animal that got in the way. They're probably ecstatic that there's so much distrust between outdoors enthusiasts and the environmental movement, because it weakens both groups and prevents them from presenting a unified front.

Have you forgotten the gold mining operations in Utah and Nevada that dump tons of mercury every year? The ones that the state governments are too spineless to stand up to? The mercury that drifts and flows into Idaho and makes it into the animals we eat? Or how about the agricultural development around Lake Lowell that is responsible for the consumption advisories and disgusting algae blooms? Or the cattle operations around the Snake River that kill fish and cause elevated E. coli counts?

We have a lot of common ground and problems both groups want to see solved. The whole "envionmetalists are godless heathens who want to steal our children and take away our land" attitude doesn't help anyone.
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I believe I've mentioned this before, but I have several friends who are retired from the Fish & Wildlife Service. They retired because the USFWS has changed from professional people who hunted and fished to radical environmentalists who are mainly interested in endangered species. They care little about hunting and fishing.

Quote:Or how about the agricultural development around Lake Lowell that is responsible for the consumption advisories and disgusting algae blooms? Or the cattle operations around the Snake River that kill fish and cause elevated E. coli counts?

I have lived on Lake Lowell for 53 years and have fishing the Snake River just as long. The river is cleaner than it was back then, and the fishing is every bit as good, if not better than it was. I've seen no fish kills on the river where I fish. I average around 1000 bass from the lake and in the 1500-2000 smallmouth from the river every year and they are extremely healthy in both places.

That's the thing that gripes me the most about the Lake Lowell plans. There was nothing that needed correcting. Don't try to fix what ain't broke.
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