Fishing Forum

Some of you might remember I just got a motor from my Uncle. He told me it was new and had never been on a boat. It has been started. He bought the motor from My other uncles farm sale. They started the motor in a barrel to sell it. The tag from the store is still on the motor. It is a 1996 4 hp Johnson Seahorse.
I plan to put this on my Steelheader.com pontoon boat. I think I am going to wait for spring to start it up now. I was going to try to get to get another trip this fall but I am running out of time with hunting. Ron
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Hey, the price was right[laugh] I imagine not as quiet as you four stroke, and the fumes might be a problem. Hope not.
There does seem to be a water pump (problem)history with that motor.

Plus let us know if you can go forward and reverse., or if there is a neutral/idle.

And wanted to ask, what is "my Steelheader.com pontoon boat" Do you work for them now?

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It will be interesting to see how loud it will be. I can live with it being a little loud just running into the sturgeon holes. That one trip I do is 16 miles round trip so any speed increase will be nice. I am keeping the Coleman for trolling. That motor runs slow enough to troll the speed I like.

I don't know about fumes. I guess any gas motor is going to have them. This one exhausts under water like most older motors did[crazy]. That will keep it down some what. []

The water pumps on these are plastic. I have read that they do go out once and a while. A friend of mine has one and he has to replace it every five years of so. He trolls with it so he puts a lot of miles on it.

I got very lucky with this motor this motor has neutral and forward. This motor turns 360 so I can turn the motor and pull with this one like I do with the Coleman.
I don't know if it will be strong enough to pull Jacob and his boat the 16 mile trip. Right now my 2.6 just barely got me through the tricky spot. Not many boats can make it through that spot right now.

Heck no I don't work for Skookum Products. I don't have that kind of voo doo to arrange anything like that. But for Top quality boats that are so good that the rest of the industry copied them. All a person has to do is go to
http://www.steelheader.com/
50 year warranty on the frame 15 year warranty on the pontoons. And 100% satisfaction you got the best boat on the river.[][]
Ron
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Good luck with the motor.
As for the boat...to each their own and I am truly glad you have found yours.
Correct me if I am wrong, but Skookum only makes the frame.
I am a wimp and prefer light[laugh]
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Hey Ron,

Hope a little correction is OK , and some day we WILL get together [fishin]
But for Top quality boats that are so good that the rest of the industry copied them. All a person has to do is go to
[url "http://www.steelheader.com/"][/url]http://www.steelheader.com/[/url]

I would not say the " rest of them " copied them.
If I am correct "Ken " from catchercraft
[url "http://www.catchercraft.com/"][/url]http://www.catchercraft.com/[/url]
worked for Billt Skokum building / designing his frames.

When the daughter took over ( steelheader.com ) Ken helped out for a while fixing frames for her. This while he was running and taking care of his own business aka Catchercraft boats.

Thats why he has an almost exact copy for his products - his designs to begin with. And actually has made better improvments /additions to them since. Both are very good products. But with Catchercraft being somewhat less money and a little better design and ability to customize, personally Catchercraft all the way.

Even though I did not purchase my cataraft thru Catchercraft I have to say Ken was a great person and gave me tons of info KNOWING I was going to purchase elsewhere. Why ? Ken was at a min 4 months out for the purchase.

Now with the few problems / accidents along the way - my order was that long anyway .[crazy] Still glad I went the way I did though.

Also yes most ( not all ) build frames or part out ( NRS ) frames , Steelheader / Catchercraft / Bad Cat ect and use Maxxon tubes.
All good products at a decent price.
Generally next step up is almost twice the cost.

Always feell free to correct me / add anything I missed.
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Yep they only make the frame. Kind of like your truck it is an american name but the parts are made in Mexico. Or your Merc Motor on your boat made in what china?
Daves Own "steelheadeer" appears to have Maxxon pontoons. They sure look like them with the end caps and valves. Maybe they are not but if they aren't he sure made a "copy" of the Maxxon. Ron
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I have not talked to Jennifer about this yet but I do have to think that Bill had a dream and a design before his business was made. It would not make sense to not have a plan or a dream before entering a venture or business.
As for Ken's designs. When a person works for a company designing and making anything they are being paid for that. Most companies own those designs due to that person working for the company. I know things I have designed in the feed industry are owned by my company I don't own the idea.

Whether the design was his to begin with or Bill's I will ask. To be honest the original design had to be Bill's. Ken may have refined or made changes. Like I said I will find out.

Catchercraft was not a great deal less as far as cash went a couple hundred at most. Availability was a big deal. I don't know if he doesn't want to hire people to help or if he is SWAMPED. Either way 4 to 6 months for a wait is excessive. That is the reason I went SKookum. When I wanted it they said two weeks.

I have over 100 river miles on my boat now both floating and under power. I can also say I am happy with my purchase. Would the Catchercraft or Canyon be just as good ? Probably. The Skookum boats have been known for a long time as one of, if not the best Cataraft available. Not saying that the others are not as good

Mine is a great boat. I love it. Ron


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[quote idahoron]Yep they only make the frame. Kind of like your truck it is an american name but the parts are made in Mexico. Or your Merc Motor on your boat made in what china?
Daves Own "steelheadeer" appears to have Maxxon pontoons. They sure look like them with the end caps and valves. Maybe they are not but if they aren't he sure made a "copy" of the Maxxon. Ron[/quote]



wow. All this from my mentioning they just make frames? touchy subject, I guess.
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Only for you. I don't have a problem with it you brought it up like you always do. []

Here is the long version that I have been holding back for way too long. Remember I do like you and I do value some of your opinions.[cool]

When someone brings up getting a new boat all we here from you is, they are not made here in the USA. Or " only the frames are made here". Are you looking out for them or are you selling a boat for NFO? Your saying that every thread, every dro of glue, fabric, and even the steel it's self is only american made. NOT one fiber of the NFO product is foreign?
If your saying that then we need to see some documentation. I don't believe that for one minute. Not in this global economy we have today.

I have seen it several times where you recommend a boat to someone that can't afford an NFO boat. A lot of people don't have the money to spend on his overly expensive boats.
Without regard to the persons finances you push your agenda down their throats. Even in my own case as you were trying to push an x5 down my throat. I told you a Sturgeon could not be landed on a x5 from the side in zodiac style. I think you still feel I am wrong even though you have never done it. Your reply was big fish are landed from the side. Big what, trout?
NO ONE HAS EVER LANDED A STURGEON ON THE SIDE OF A X5 ZODIAC STYLE. If a Sturgeon has been landed in an X5 we would know about it. If I am wrong I will buy you lunch. I want to see pictures, and better yet a video.

You fail to see there is more than one way to fish and no one boat fits all. No one maker fits all. A young man with limited funds asked a while back about a boat and instantly he was hit with the sales pitch that he needs a boat that will cost close to 1000.00 dollars. He had 200 to work with. He was made to think he was failing some how because he was thinking about a boat that might not be a NFO.

You accused me of working for Skookum, but I got to ask. What is YOUR kick back from NFO for Pimping his products like a trained sales person?
Then when people have trouble with NFO and there always is, you have to step in to try to help with customer satisfaction. In reality I hear more negative reviews on NFO for customer satisfaction than anything else. Well maybe that is not true. I here a lot of complaining about price. NFO is not for everyone. Do I think they are a good boat? Yes I do! I would have one if I thought I needed one. But I don't. They don't offer anything I need at this time.

Your last thread on the Tube and Toon section was an all out sales pitch. Only 5 pounds and perfect for this, or perfect for that. YOU have that audacity to accuse ME of working for a manufacture. So come out with it what is your cut? No one works as hard for a company as you. What is your percentage? If your doing that for free your playing right into his hands. Maybe you get free boats? Either way the pot called the kettle black.

Buying USA is important for all of us when we can I do it my self. But when we can't that is ok. It was ok for you to buy a foreign made motor right? When I post I got a USA made motor your down on it, why? Johnson/ evinrude made motors here and over seas. Are you against them because they are a global company? Is the motor perfect? No but I don't know anything that is. Except what you personally have. Everything you have is the best that ever was the rest of us are a lower class to you. Why did you feel the need to run down the motor? Do you get kick backs for selling Merc? Do you sell merc so you just want to make a sale?

I am sure if you looked at your regular purchases many more items are not made here. But you flog a potential boat buyer with it and make them feel like they are Red Chinese for even thinking about a boat that is not made here or all that parts are not made here.

So next time before you tell me to take the stick out of my eye take the plank out of yours. I say this with all due respect. []
Ron
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[shocked] [unimpressed]
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[quote idahoron]Only for you. I don't have a problem with it you brought it up like you always do. []

Here is the long version that I have been holding back for way too long. Remember I do like you and I do value some of your opinions.[cool]

When someone brings up getting a new boat all we here from you is, they are not made here in the USA. Or " only the frames are made here". Are you looking out for them or are you selling a boat for NFO? Your saying that every thread, every dro of glue, fabric, and even the steel it's self is only american made.
[#ff0000]Actually the are all USA made right down to the top grade Aluminum used in the frame. Why should he buy the toons for the Steelheader when he can make them himself. And the end caps are not a trade mark for Maxxon, they have been used for years.[/#ff0000]
NOT one fiber of the NFO product is foreign?
[#ff0000]Maybe that is all you read. Actually I recommended Outcast and Bucks bags made up there in Idaho. And as for float tubes I said ODC was a good deal. Better go back and read. Koch was the one at always mentioned NFO.[/#ff0000]

If your saying that then we need to see some documentation. I don't believe that for one minute. Not in this global economy we have today.
[#ff0000]Never said any of this[/#ff0000]

I have seen it several times where you recommend a boat to someone that can't afford an NFO boat. A lot of people don't have the money to spend on his overly expensive boats.

[#ff0000]Read my first answer, that goes here as well. I do recommend NFO to people that can afford them however, and I am surely not alone on this.[/#ff0000]

Without regard to the persons finances you push your agenda down their throats. Even in my own case as you were trying to push an x5 down my throat.
[#ff0000]Backing up a bit, you PM's me asking ME about the X5...nowhere have I ever pushed these boats down peoples throat.
[/#ff0000]I told you a Sturgeon could not be landed on a x5 from the side in zodiac style.
[#ff0000]Correction, YOU (your words) can't land a sturgeon on this style boat. What's the real difference between the zodiac style fishing and fishing from a boat?[/#ff0000]
I think you still feel I am wrong even though you have never done it. Your reply was big fish are landed from the side. Big what, trout?
NO ONE HAS EVER LANDED A STURGEON ON THE SIDE OF A X5 ZODIAC STYLE. If a Sturgeon has been landed in an X5 we would know about it. If I am wrong I will buy you lunch. I want to see pictures, and better yet a video.
[#ff0000]According to who? Not everyone photographs or videos their fishing trips.
This does not mean it cannot be done. No reason on earth it cannot be done[/#ff0000]
You fail to see there is more than one way to fish and no one boat fits all. No one maker fits all. A young man with limited funds asked a while back about a boat and instantly he was hit with the sales pitch that he needs a boat that will cost close to 1000.00 dollars. He had 200 to work with. He was made to think he was failing some how because he was thinking about a boat that might not be a NFO.

You accused me of working for Skookum, but I got to ask. What is YOUR kick back from NFO for Pimping his products like a trained sales person?
[#ff0000]Accuse you of working for Skookum? Man, are you reading something no one else is? I simply asked if you were working for them now. Just a simple question. Nothing more.
Real simple answer here, I don't keep posting about catching fish in my "Outlaw X5 or "nfo.com" I do give consumer reviews. I even pointed out I didn't like the Escape. [/#ff0000]
Then when people have trouble with NFO and there always is, you have to step in to try to help with customer satisfaction. In reality I hear more negative reviews on NFO for customer satisfaction than anything else. Well maybe that is not true. I here a lot of complaining about price.
[#ff0000]A not sure why you made this statement then say it isn't true, but it got it off your chest. NFO sales way more boats than Skookum or Cataraft. A salesman for Cataraft even posted this. Selling this many boats, one or two may have a problem, excuse me if I live close enough to try and help.
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NFO is not for everyone.
[#ff0000]Again, my first answer[/#ff0000]

Do I think they are a good boat? Yes I do! I would have one if I thought I needed one. But I don't. They don't offer anything I need at this time.

Your last thread on the Tube and Toon section was an all out sales pitch. Only 5 pounds and perfect for this, or perfect for that. YOU have that audacity to accuse ME of working for a manufacture.
[#ff0000]It was a REVIEW, Ron. I do have people asking me about these things and again, I live close enough to find out.
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So come out with it what is your cut? No one works as hard for a company as you. What is your percentage? If your doing that for free your playing right into his hands. Maybe you get free boats? Either way the pot called the kettle black.
[#ff4040]I give product reviews, and I give fishing reports, no percentage, and no name plug.com in every report.[/#ff4040] [#ff0000]I don't own any of the new boats, but I did get to see them first hand and I was asked to report about them[/#ff0000]
Buying USA is important for all of us when we can I do it my self. But when we can't that is ok. It was ok for you to buy a foreign made motor right? When I post I got a USA made motor your down on it, why? Johnson/ evinrude made motors here and over seas. Are you against them because they are a global company? Is the motor perfect?
[#ff4040]This is all out there Ron, I have never made any of these statements. I do agree to buy American when you can but not always the case...never said different. It is next to impossible to buy 100% USA made motor these days, anyone knows this. [/#ff4040]

No but I don't know anything that is. Except what you personally have. Everything you have is the best that ever was the rest of us are a lower class to you. Why did you feel the need to run down the motor? Do you get kick backs for selling Merc? Do you sell merc so you just want to make a sale?
[#ff4040]Run down the motor? What the heck are you reading? I asked the obvious questions. Really.[/#ff4040]

I am sure if you looked at your regular purchases many more items are not made here. But you flog a potential boat buyer with it and make them feel like they are Red Chinese for even thinking about a boat that is not made here or all that parts are not made here.

[#ff4040]WOW! Again, I live in America, I understand global economy, I am writing this on a Computer.[/#ff4040] [#ff4040]What is with all the China accusations? All this cause I asked if you worked for them?[/#ff4040]

So next time before you tell me to take the stick out of my eye take the plank out of yours. I say this with all due respect. []
Ron[/quote]

[#ff4040]The last comment is not worth an answer, and I say that with all due respect. You have a nice day, Ron.[/#ff4040]
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[shocked][shocked][shocked]
Sorry Ron If I offended you.

Yes I know you went with Steelheader.com for the fact it could be shipped within a week or two and I understand that mattered a lot.
During my purchase decisions I wanted to go with a solid welded aluminum frame , one of my major criteria. Along with that was the major cost increase understandably. Now overkill for floating the snake - no argument there [:p]

Catchercraft was very close for my order at first when I was considering going with something other than what I really wanted .
They could customize some aspects also but at a longer wait. The wait was as long as Canyon's. And as far as Steelheader.com great product for the price no argument - for me it all came to a personal issue that is not relevant here.

Catchercraft and Skokum/ Steelheader.com ARE ALMOST EXACT COPIES OF EACH OTHER frame material /design and Maxxon tubes.Irrespective of who anyone goes thru they are so comparable it's picking nats off of a fleas backside [] I hope I now made that clear.[]

Badcat different frame design - Maxxon tubes. Same comment.

Like I said there are also some with NRS frames and then Maxxon tubes and the reason for that some want to customize the frames to their liking. With NRS components ANYONE can put together a very stout frame on top of Maxxon tubes.

For anyone looking at your video's looking for a comparable cataraft which is what they are really called - take your choice for whatever reason - delivery time, some small difference that you like ,personal feeling about company they really are that close.

On a final note : As far as the intimate details of the relationship between Skokum/Steelheader.com and Catchercraft all I can say is this.
There a a few boards that go thru that quite a bit , some who accused Ken of stealing /copying Skokums design.

The facts are Ken worked for Bill Skokum making up the frames.
When the business was taken over by the daughter there was problems with the frame manufacturing - lets face it someone had to take over from scratch when Ken started his own business - that person made mistakes / had problems getting up to speed.
Ken helped by making repairs on some frames from steelheader even though he now had his own business.
THAT tells me what a class act Ken ( and his business Catchercraft ) is.
HE will not go into this - another class act.
Last, but certainly not least of all is this - if anyone was guilty of stealing anyones intellectual property they would most certainly get sued. That has not happened.
Whatever the business relationship was initially it remains between them for whatever reason.
When I asked ( way to many ) questions of many people / company's you learn a lot. Especially from a small closely knit bunch of Company's.
Which is why I DID NOT even consider one unnamed company from ANY consideration. Sorry Ron I don't want to start ANOTHER confrontation [crazy]
Hey looking forward to helping you with the mods if you stilll want to. AFTER Deer season[]
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No offense taken. I am going to forward this all to Jennifer and see if she would like to straiten out any misinformation if there is any.

As to the stealing of intellectual property. It would depend if the property had a patent on it. Even at that all a company has to do is change a small thing and it is off the hook on patent problems. Like I said I hope Jennifer will address this but maybe she won't.

I do understand that Ken did work for Bill Day building frames. I can't help but think that the original ideas for the boats had to be Bill Day's. Again this would be a good one for Jennifer to address.

NO confrontation between us. At least I didn't take it that way. Anyway, I don't think I am planning any mods on my boat right now. I was thinking about different side boards with the plastic but I am not sure it would be worth the switch. I am going to need to figure up a spot for my gas tank for the new motor. I can't wait to try that bad boy out. Ron
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It will be interesting to she if Jennifer clarifies this,really I think it would help both companies.

On a few boards there was a BIG confontation between different followers as to copycating / stealing between the two companies. To the point of ridiculous name calling between people.

I think both are excellent companies and I recommended both to you. It is rather funny that even though knowing this confontation existed I failed to mention it during our conversations - oh well.[blush]

I did not want anyone thinking Catchercraft a bad company, therefore my explanation.

I was not referring to a confrontation between us.[:p]
I was going to reply regarding other comments in your thread.
I did not for certain people take exception to criticism or negative opinions of that company. And I did not feel right to rehash an old thread considering my reply is regarding steelheader / cathercraft.
Besides you did an EXTREMELY effective job of it yourself .[][]
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I have an old trolling motor stand in my shop that I believe says Johnson Seahorse on it. I don't know how long Johnson made seahorses but I would have thought my stand is from the 60's judging the paint and construction. Maybe I am way off?
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You might be right. I think they were made before that. Ron
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Wow, this turned into a pissing match pretty quick.

What ever happened to "argee to disagree?"
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2 stroke all the way thats what I'm talken bout!
The older motors will run forever compared to todays JUNK..BRING BACK THE TWO STROKES!!!!!!

If thats an air cooled motor then I want one!
Heres my little beauty was sitting in an attic for 25years brand new..first picture is with the brand new tag as well ..should of seen the bidding wars on ebay
I had to get her no matter what!
This is the third 1.75 hp I've owned
One day I'll make a video with all three on my 10' jon boat and get a million views over night you wait and see[]
Heres a reacent video of twin 1.75 running with gear
on jon boat
Enjoy the motor..P
P.S.my nephew has and early 80's 4hp MERC on youtbe
If you'd like to check out .."4hp merc" his youtube ch is boater305
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lol metalheadgene !
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