Fishing Forum

I have heard rumors that the kokanee are spawning up Big elk. anyone know for sure? I was hoping to take some kids out on the boat for some good fun.
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If they are, and they usually are right now, theres not much need to put in the boat. Walk the creek from the inlet up to just above the YMCA camp. The water is so clear you can see them pretty easy. Ive even seen retreivers get after it and catch them in that stretch.
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They most likely are. Take pics and let them do their thing. . Just my opinion. Have fun
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[quote oregonguy]They most likely are. Take pics and let them do their thing. . Just my opinion. Have fun[/quote]

Great advise! This is how the biomass produces the future fishing of Big Elk. The easier they have it the easier our future catching will be!
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Just curious, but it is not illegal to go try and catch and release a few Fish in hopes of landing a male in spawn form. If it is unethical then why don't I see similar suggestions to people fishing spawning crappie, or steelhead or salmon for that matter? I am not intending on breaking any laws or even keeping any Fish so what difference does it make?
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I didn't make an aggressive post. I even stated if your going then have fun. If you want to catch one that's fine and absolutely legal. My opinion is that it's best not to sit there and snag and catch a bunch of them that finely made it to the stream. My reason for thinking this way is that it is a natural Kokanee run at palies. They no longer stock them. The numbers of Kokanee in palies are not super high so I just think leaving them be once getting to the spawning grounds is better. However, that is only my opinion. I am allowed my opinion no different then you. If you go and catch some I hope you do well and the kids have a blast because that is what's important
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They aren't eating so . . . as long as you aren't snagging them I suppose you can do as you like. Remember, the meat is rotten so you can't eat them either.
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I understand where you are coming from. I apologize for the aggressive response. This forum can be a really great thing but sometimes I see it as a way people just criticize others. I realize that was not your intention.
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[quote MMDon]They aren't eating so . . . as long as you aren't snagging them I suppose you can do as you like. Remember, the meat is rotten so you can't eat them either.[/quote]

Actually when they are right out of the res they take San Juan worms really well and they taste great when they are that fresh. End of the day I can see both sides to catch and eat as they are fantastic or watch and appreciate the display. To each their own.
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[quote Bmarsh][quote MMDon]They aren't eating so . . . as long as you aren't snagging them I suppose you can do as you like. Remember, the meat is rotten so you can't eat them either.[/quote]

Actually when they are right out of the res they take San Juan worms really well and they taste great when they are that fresh. End of the day I can see both sides to catch and eat as they are fantastic or watch and appreciate the display. To each their own.[/quote]

Really, you eat that garbage. First all of their own body changes are pulled from their own flesh leaving mush and what's left goes into the spawning process. They aren't really edible from the day they begin to absorb their own scales and turn a pinkish gray. From that point on you are really just eating rotting fish flesh.
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When they are a mile out of the res? Yes Sir, I've had a couple that were smoked and they were as good as the ones we pull through the ice. That close to the res and early they are still in good shape. Now try and do it on the tail end .......that I wouldn't recommend.



[quote MMDon][quote Bmarsh][quote MMDon]They aren't eating so . . . as long as you aren't snagging them I suppose you can do as you like. Remember, the meat is rotten so you can't eat them either.[/quote]

Actually when they are right out of the res they take San Juan worms really well and they taste great when they are that fresh. End of the day I can see both sides to catch and eat as they are fantastic or watch and appreciate the display. To each their own.[/quote]

Really, you eat that garbage. First all of their own body changes are pulled from their own flesh leaving mush and what's left goes into the spawning process. They aren't really edible from the day they begin to absorb their own scales and turn a pinkish gray. From that point on you are really just eating rotting fish flesh. [.img][url "http://www.bigfishtackle.com/images/gforum/dumb.gif[/img][/quote]"]http://www.bigfishtackle.com/...b.gif[/img][/quote][/url]
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[quote MMDon][quote Bmarsh][quote MMDon]They aren't eating so . . . as long as you aren't snagging them I suppose you can do as you like. Remember, the meat is rotten so you can't eat them either.[/quote]

Actually when they are right out of the res they take San Juan worms really well and they taste great when they are that fresh. End of the day I can see both sides to catch and eat as they are fantastic or watch and appreciate the display. To each their own.[/quote]

Really, you eat that garbage. First all of their own body changes are pulled from their own flesh leaving mush and what's left goes into the spawning process. They aren't really edible from the day they begin to absorb their own scales and turn a pinkish gray. From that point on you are really just eating rotting fish flesh. [.img]http://www.bigfishtackle.com/images/gforum/dumb.gif[/img][/quote]


MMDon, that is flat out untrue. I don't fish the run, never have, it's not my style. But, I do know a couple guys who fish that run sometimes and I have a smoker, so I have encountered more than a few of these fish when they brought them over to use my smoker. They only kept the males. The meat is not rotten. Anadromous fish don't mutate into rotting zombies on a run, they just rob their body of all its fat stores. The rotting zombie fish thing starts after the fish has spawned and is dying. Anyhowz, these guys were targeting lightly colored males ascending the creek, not fish on redds. Fishing over redds is another issue entirely.

The meat gets dry and starts to taste like a white-meat hatchery trout. It really depends on how ripe the salmon. I've had some that was lightly colored up and once it was brined and properly smoked salmon jerky style, it was actually good. The riper ones tasted like a low quality trout with a lot of smoke on it. Of course, if someone is soaking fish in brine and hot smoking it dry with black pepper, you know it isn't proper table quality. But rotten? Absolutely not. Does it taste like crap compared to a proper koke? Taste is subjective, to a point.

It doesn't matter that the fish have stopped feeding. You catch them by the tried and true aggravation method. I've fished kings, pinks, chums and sockeyes in AK and those sport fisheries are based on fish that have stopped feeding but not biting. Once they are ashore, you have to aggravate those salmon. You swing a bright colored fly across a group of salmon and if one moves towards your fly, that fish may be "bite ready." Next cast, you try to present the fly to the bite ready target and see if it snaps at the fly. My buds told me that 10 years ago, the creek was a real junk show of snaggers and litterers but IDF&G aggressively patrols the run these days.

Also, I'll point out that biomass is biomass. Catching dozens of kokes in the lake instead of taking half a dozen at the inlet doesn't equate to any sort of moral superiority. It just means you took more biomass out of the run and have much better taste in fish.
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If the meat wasn't off-putting we certainly wouldn't switch to the smaller 2 year olds while the larger spawners are still in the lake. To each his own but I fish with a lot of Kokanee fishermen that catch hundreds a year and none of us would keep a turned fish. Maybe we're just spoiled at having an unlimited supply of fish that haven't gone bad. For us, there isn't enough brine or smoke in the world. Someone once said putting lipstick on a pig only meant you still had a pig, now wearing lipstick.

I don't fish Big Elk so I don't have a dog in the fight of trying to preserve the fishery. If you can't catch them any other way, it is legal. I just shudder at the thought of eating fish, probably only good for dog food or your flower garden.

I'm out of here on this one! Enjoy!
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[quote MMDon]If the meat wasn't off-putting we certainly wouldn't switch to the smaller 2 year olds while the larger spawners are still in the lake. To each his own but I fish with a lot of Kokanee fishermen that catch hundreds a year and none of us would keep a turned fish. Maybe we're just spoiled at having an unlimited supply of fish that haven't gone bad. For us, there isn't enough brine or smoke in the world. Someone once said putting lipstick on a pig only meant you still had a pig, now wearing lipstick.

I don't fish Big Elk so I don't have a dog in the fight of trying to preserve the fishery. If you can't catch them any other way, it is legal. I just shudder at the thought of eating fish, probably only good for dog food or your flower garden. [.img]http://www.bigfishtackle.com/images/gforum/happy.gif[/img]

I'm out of here on this one! Enjoy![/quote]


Like I said, its not my cup of tea either. I could drive to that run in 30 minutes but I never have. Frankly, I don't know why folks get so excited to meat fish the salmon and steelhead runs in Idaho. Once you've eaten a chrome bright steelhead caught right above the bay or a springer caught in the lower Columbia, the thought of eating a tired fish that just swam all the way to Challis isn't very appealing. But, I know that many anglers on this board feel otherwise.
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Are there any reports that the fish are there for sure? Just curios since I have a little boy that would love to see them.

As far as Salmon and Steelhead go,there is nothing quite like it. I don't keep any in the upper salmon because of the aformentioned reason, but I love to chase them for the challenge. The Salmon that are on the lower Salmon eat really well and cut really pink. I'd almost compare them to the Alaskan Kings right from the inlets.

Back to the Kokanee..How long do they run in Big Elk? How big do they get?
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by now it will be done but 14-28 inches is fairly common
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28 inches ????? I don't think so. That would be about a 9 pound fish
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Have myself personally taped up to 23 inches in Palies. Biggest Koks by far than in any lake in our area. As soon as you net they leave those fine scales everywhere. Only problem I have with Palies is the consistency of catching them in the same place. I meter them at the cliffs in schools but can't seem to get on them anywhere else except by accident.
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Tazasorus is not exaggerating at all. I took a hike up there with my little guy to see them and fish for some Cutties (Grasshoppers were hot!) Some of the larger males were easily between the 20-24" range. I also saw some dead fish with weighted treble hooks in their sides...Not Cool
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Good to hear some big ones were up there. The more I study salmon runs the more I see that they help with the water quality and animals in the areas that they occur in.
Pretty cool when you look at it, essentially its a delivered protein source back to the heads of drainages every fall right when predators are trying to pack weight on for winter.
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