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+--- Thread: noob questions (/showthread.php?tid=539300)
noob questions - fsh4fun05 - 10-31-2009
I'm a bass fisherman, I'll use my fly rod on my toon to drag around a bugger or small fly up at Pelican for some easy bluegill and bass but other than that my casting ability is laughable, lack of practice. I have a Pflueger rod, 5wt fly line (weight forward, just bought it today) and my leader, I believe, goes to 4lb test.
Questions: What is a safe tippet for trout? What is the best knot to tie from leader to tippet? What is the best knot to tie on a small fly? The box of line that I got recommended a backer line, why? Most importantly, where's a good place for a noob to go fly fishing on a river in Utah? I've got some time off work and I'd like to use it to go fly fishing, or at the very least get some experience. I would appreciate any help at all, criticism is welcomed also but you still have to help a little [
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Re: [fsh4fun05] noob questions - sinergy - 10-31-2009
I always carry 4x, 5x, & 6x but it also depends on the size of fly your going to fish
heres a good chart
http://www.orvis.com/intro.aspx?dir_id=758&subject=2202
I could be wrong but I think the general rule is divide the fly size by 3 so size 18 fly would be 6x and so on. I think there room for a size up or down so you could even go 5x or 7x on a size 18 fly.
Knots can be a heated discussion everybody has there preference but for leader to tippet I use a blood knot For tippet to fly I uses either a palamor, improved clinch or non slip loop knot.
Fly lines usually run 100 to 120 feet if a fish makes a run for it backing gives you some extra line to work with I highly recommend running backing on your reel.
For noobs I would suggest either the Middle Provo or the Weber not that its an un-challenging placeto fish but both rivers can leave you skunked any day of the week but there is lots of fish and its not too technical.
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Re: [sinergy] noob questions - flygoddess - 10-31-2009
Most fly lines are 90 ft.
Like Sin mentioned, backing is a must for a running fish, plus it helps fill out the proper sized reel so the line won't come off to curly.
Now, the next part is just my choice.
I use P-Line fluorocarbon for tippet. One, it is allot less money and I use long lengths on sinking lines and on my Furled Leaders.
I buy 2, 4, 6, 8 and 12 for carp.
I connect to to the leader with a double surgeon's knot or to my furled ring with a clinch.
As far as flies, I learned a little trick many years ago. I use as heavy of tippet I can still get through the eye of the hook, but I use a "SURGEON'S LOOP". This way, I can use heavier tippet, but still let the fly move freely.
ex: I use 6X or 2lb on a #32 fly.
One last note: Regular fluoro like I use is a larger diameter than tippet, this can be a bad thing at times. Where you are fishing bigger bugs, I don't see it being a bad thing but more a money saver.
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Re: [fsh4fun05] noob questions - albinotrout - 10-31-2009
As FG put it backing is a must for the line. I use as small a tippet that I can for trout. I carry enough in all sizes. I also carry spools of tippet material as well as leader material. I use a double surgeons loop to tie tippet and leader to the leader line attached to the fly line. Easier to change out that way when it gets too short. I use both sinking line (uniform sink) and floating line. I have two spools for my fly line and looking to add a third with a bass taper. I use a 5 wt rod so all my line is 5 weight. Looked at a 3/4 weight once and decided against it after I spoke with one who used it in the past. I think I would only use it for really small streams or uintas.
Almost forgot, I use the modified clinch knot on all my flies. I even use it on other baits as well due to its strength.
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Re: [fsh4fun05] noob questions - fsh4fun05 - 11-05-2009
Thank you for the replies and pm's. I used my fly rod to drag a bugger up at Strawberry (I know, that's cheating [
]) but I bagged a couple nice cutts and learned the importance of backing. I was afraid I was going to break the line so I might have given to much slack but man do they fight on a fly rod! I got two on the boat but when I lost three in a row I broke out the trusty baitcaster with a tube. Without sounding too desperate is there somebody in the SLC area that can teach me how to cast a fly line? I was sight fishing (catching) cutts that were hitting spiders on the surface with tubes and cranks but I just can't get the casting thing with the fly rod, it could have been a stellar day if I could just fling that damn fly without it coiling up 10' in front of me...I don't ask for help for often so go easy on me [blush].
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Re: [fsh4fun05] noob questions - flygoddess - 11-05-2009
I hit Willow pond allot. Try out new flies and last night, helped a Scout get his badge ...landed two fish.
One thing I want you to be aware of. Some rods and lines are not compatible and do not play well together.
That is why I stress a good line.
But it can also be the rod.
Ex: I tried a rod that a Fellow BFTer built. Nice blank (boron) and great feel, but, for some reason I don't know, he has put a very tiny stripping guide on. Now in the old days with bamboo and silk line this was the norm, and maybe the builder is old school.
Any rate, the rod was very hard to load up. Maybe a two size heavier line, but I think it is more the striping guide and overall guide placement.
So, you do have to get something that works well together.
The higher more specialized lines will make an inexpensive rod cast like a dream however.
I will tell you to practice. Think of painting the underside of a shelf, not a windshield wiper. And try standing slightly side ways and watch your line. Make sure you wait for it to straighten out in the back.
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Re: [fsh4fun05] noob questions - sinergy - 11-05-2009
[quote fsh4fun05] I used my fly rod to drag a bugger up at Strawberry (I know, that's cheating [
]) .[/quote] I was fishing Logan and got tired of winding up my reel and securing the hook to the rod. As I walked upstream I just let the fly sit in the water and draged my line from spot to spot. Got a very weird look from a guy I told him that I was Trolling [
] As far as casting goes if you got the $$$ I suggest hiring a guide/ 1/2 day drip will do you wonders. But you always welcome to come fish with me don't when I might be going again weather permitting hopefully this weekend also if your in the Herriman area I could show you the basics at a park but Im no guide [cool]
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Re: [fsh4fun05] noob questions - Tapajos - 11-06-2009
Guess you found me! If you wondered why I havent been to our bass meetings or tournaments this year I've been chuckin bugs all year! Hit me up if you still have my # and lets go chase them on the MW!
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Re: [flygoddess] noob questions - fsh4fun05 - 11-07-2009
I have an assortment of baitcasting and spinning rods/reels that I use and I feel comfortable with them. I've swapped reels, lines, rods, etc. to find the right match. I don't really want to do that with fly rods. I understand the importance of having the right setup, it usually costs a bit more but it's worth it in the end. I imagine it's the same way with fly fishing.
I will probably end up with a[url "http://www.lamiglas.com/pf_fly.php"] Lamiglas fly rod[/url] so I could use some help on choosing a good one, 5wt preferably. Of course, like mentioned, I'll need a good line. I can't say money is not an issue but my main concern is quality and casting. I know nothing about the reels but what little time I have under my belt the reel just held the line and I would pull the line in when I had a fish.
From what I've wrote what would be the optimal setup?
Sinergy: Thank you for the invite, Herriman is just a few minutes from me. I need to learn the basics before I can justify hiring a guide so any help would be appreciated. I'll check my schedule and shoot you a pm.
What's up Joe. I'll see if I have your number. I've had big bass the last two years and angler of the year the last two years. Greg has Lou Gehrigs disease and only fished two early tourneys this year, he's lost the ability to move his arms now but he is still in good spirits. Sad to see such a great person and fisherman like that.
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Re: [fsh4fun05] noob questions - flygoddess - 11-07-2009
Never tried a Lami graphite...but I love the E glass.
A good inexpensive line would be the PEACH by Cortland, but for Trout, I personally prefer the Rio Selective Trout II.
Reel isn't a big issue for trout but a fair drag can come into play.
Also the right weight reel to balance out on the rod. You don't want a 6 oz reel on a 3 oz rod and vise versa.
I picked up a Martin LA for a very inexpensive price. Good drag and solid reel.
Don't forget BACKING also[
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Re: [flygoddess] noob questions - fsh4fun05 - 11-07-2009
Easy there lady [
], remember I know nothing of fly fishing. I didn't know there were different weights of reels. I'm trying to avoid another expensive fishing experience by avoiding trial and error and get the right rod/reel the first time. I see that a perfect fly rod setup is like asking for the perfect baitcasting setup, too many variables. What is your favorite setup? Line/rod/reel etc?[signature]
Re: [fsh4fun05] noob questions - kochanut - 11-07-2009
here you go:
[url "http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/product/standard-item.jsp?id=0051114320440a&navCount=2&podId=0051114&parentId=cat20457&masterpathid=&navAction=push&cmCat=MainCatcat20431-cat20457_TGP&catalogCode=UK&rid=&parentType=index&indexId=cat20457&hasJS=true"]http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/product/standard-item.jsp?id=0051114320440a&navCount=2&podId=0051114&parentId=cat20457&masterpathid=&navAction=push&cmCat=MainCatcat20431-cat20457_TGP&catalogCode=UK&rid=&parentType=index&indexId=cat20457&hasJS=true[/url]
90 bucks. thats what im trying to get Trout_Slayer set up with so he can start fly fishing. i even have a few cabelas 5 and 8 weight rods i still use, and they have never let me down. i ponied up and spent the money for some higher end rods simply because the feel of them is amazing, and im actually that dedicated(crazy) about my fly fishing
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Re: [kochanut] noob questions - flygoddess - 11-08-2009
Got to honestly say, I am not familiar with that rod. The Prestige reel yes, and a GOOD reel..as far as rod, I went with the 7 piece Stowaway and LOVED it. I gave it to my nephew who is still using it.
The only thing I don't care for in the combos is the line. I still believe, next to presentation, that the line is the most important piece of equipment.
You should see my $14. Eagle Claw cast with Shark Skin. I am not saying you need to buy a $100. line, but there is a reason the good lines are $60.+
I have scored some great line on e-bay however. Selective Trout II for $45.
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Re: [flygoddess] noob questions - sinergy - 11-08-2009
Madison River outfitters has there lines on sale 1/2 off
http://www.mrfc.com/MadisonRiverShopping/SearchResult.aspx
30.00 for there Rio Selective Trout II Lines
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Re: [sinergy] noob questions - flygoddess - 11-08-2009
Right On! Thanks Sin.
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Re: [fsh4fun05] noob questions - dr.veha - 11-18-2009
[quote fsh4fun05] Without sounding too desperate is there somebody in the SLC area that can teach me how to cast a fly line?[/quote]
I would consider myself a noob as well considering I have only been fly fishing for 4 months. With casting, the best thing you can do is practice, practice, practice. And don't go to a body of water to practice either. Go to a park or somewhere with enough room. If you go to a lake to practice, you'll be tempted to try to catch fish instead of working on your casting skills.
In the beginning...I watched youtube videos.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kLfJBTctA4Q
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hHofBrTUORE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0w6y6Kh1AtY
All the links have several videos in the series. The second link is hard to follow at times, but it does a fairly good job of teaching the double haul. The best thing about it though is that you can see what not to do.
I also read books. I bought the LL Bean book from Borders and checked out a Lefty Kreh book from the Orem library.
http://www.amazon.com/L-L-Bean-Ultimate-Book-Fishing/dp/159228891X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1258565490&sr=1-1
http://www.amazon.com/Lefty-Krehs-Presenting-Fly-Practical/dp/1592289746
I would go out a practice for 30 minutes during lunch or before work. I did this for about two weeks. And that was about it. I am not an expert at it now, but I can cast 40-60ft consistently. On land, I can double haul it to about 75-80ft, but on the water things don't quite work out the same. Part of that, as FlyGoddess mentions, is the quality of my line. (I have the Cabela's Genesis combo kit).
And because I can cast a fairly decent distance, I enjoy fly fishing just for the casting alone. I even received a nice complement about my form when I was at Tibble Fork a couple weeks ago despite catching a lot fewer fish than the person giving the complement.
Hope that helps.
-DrV
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Re: [fsh4fun05] noob questions - dr.veha - 11-18-2009
[quote fsh4fun05]What is the best knot to tie on a small fly?[/quote]
I just learned and used the Davy Knot. Really quick to tie and saves on tippet too.
http://www.fieldandstream.com/photos/gallery/kentucky/2006/06/field-streams-guide-basic-camping-and-fishing-knots-now-more-new-kno?photo=10
http://www.utahoutdoors.com/pages/Davyknot.htm
http://www.itinerantangler.com/casting/davyknot.wmv
I also will use the Duncan knot if I want the tiny fly to have some action when I am using a bigger than desired tippet.
http://www.killroys.com/knots/duncan.htm
By the way, the Duncan is also useful to use when you want to attach a dropper. Tie this to the hook bend of the top fly and it will allow for quicker change of the top fly without having to retie the dropper setup. This is because the Duncan is adjustable so you can loosen it when you want to switch.
-DrV
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