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+--- Thread: Starvation 9-12-12 (/showthread.php?tid=765973)
Starvation 9-12-12 - SBennett - 08-13-2012
We had a blast! Man I love that lake, part of me wished it was closer to SL but then it would be ruined. I guess ya gotta pay if you're gonna play.
We ended with appx. 10 eyes, only one over 20 though.
Caught rainbows that were extremely nice. They put Strawberry and Fish Lake rainbows to shame.
Does anybody know why there are no more rainbows being planted? Was it just an experiment? It will be a shame when the current stocking is caught out.
Caught smallies and tons of perch, even some in the 10-11" range.
TD was right about the fish feasting on dads. Every fish I cleaned was full of 3/4" dads.
No wind with the temps hitting 90. That will be a tough trip to beat.
Back to the rainbows, can anybody weigh in on if there is a way we could make phone calls/write a letter, etc. to continue rainbow stocking?
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Re: [SBennett] Starvation 9-12-12 - Fishrmn - 08-13-2012
I'm usually not very critical of the UDWR, but it looks like there has been some stealth planting going on. That or there is a spawning population of Rainbow Trout in Starvation Reservoir. The last "official" planting of Rainbows that I can find in their stocking report was roughly 20,000, 6" fish in 2006. That would make them 6 years old. I'm having a hard time believing that there hasn't been any Rainbows planted since then. So ... what's up?
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Re: [Fishrmn] Starvation 9-12-12 - SBennett - 08-13-2012
That is interesting, I am not sure but would love to learn more.
Maybe I am wrong but I was led to believe the RB's in Starvy were sterile planters?
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Re: [SBennett] Starvation 9-12-12 - TubeDude - 08-13-2012
[cool][#0000ff]Great report. I agree. Starvy COULD be closer, but then it wouldn't be fishable at times. Already just a bit TOO popular on some trips.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]I am aware of more than one planting of the rainbows. This spring there were definitely two different age classes...maybe three. And I was told they are triploid...sterile. They do go through the spawn cycle but the eggs do not hatch.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]I have a PM in to Drew Cushing to see if he can shed some light on the number of plantings and the plans for the future of Starvy as a trout pond.[/#0000ff]
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Re: [SBennett] Starvation 9-12-12 - Fishrmn - 08-13-2012
It might have been interesting to see what the DWR would have done with Starvation, had someone not planted Yellow Perch. Who knows what they would have done to complete the food chain there?
I'm sure the 'bows at Starvation aren't reproducing, (that was meant as
in cheek) but the stocking reports don't show any Rainbows for the last 6 years. Maybe the DWR has been taking bookkeeping lessons from Romney? The fish are there. They aren't self sustaining. They had to come from somewhere. Where? When? How many? And of course, what does the future hold?[signature]
Re: [SBennett] Starvation 9-12-12 - PrinceFisher - 08-14-2012
Great report, Mr. Bennett.
My kids and I have been fortunate to enjoy quite a few fishing trips this year, but I believe my favorite trip was with my 13-year-old son in early June to Starvation.
We caught several large rainbows, and they all fought like champs. I sure hope the UDWR will continue to use Starvation as a prime location to grow hefty, hard-fighting 'bows.
One of these days I'll figure out how to catch the walleyes there with regularity, like you do. Still, Starvation is still just about as good as it gets in my opinion.
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Re: [PrinceFisher] Starvation 9-12-12 - SBennett - 08-14-2012
Don't give me too much credit on the walleye at Starvy. Although I do get lucky and have yet to be skunked in the soft water for a couple eyes a trip, last winter through the ice I could not even buy a single walleye. That ice fishing for eyes in Utah is for people who just won't admit they love cold toes or something.
Last sunday I started out trolling for the trout as soon as we got there to take advantage of the early morning trout bite. I put out a KCT silver dodger followed by a pink squid spinner 30' down on the rigger. I set a stacker clip 10' below the surface with a KCT hothead spoon (which is a BLAST to catch fish on with 6# test/ultralight pole by the way). Not only did the hothead pay off multiple times but I caught an eye on the dodger/squid combo. I love Starvy for that exact reason, you never know what you might hook on to. Another example: My buddies kid is jigging up perch with me and we are having a ball of a time. He goes to set the hook on a love tap and his pole goes triple bendo! My buddy grabs the net and we clear that side of the boat to land what we are sure is a trophy class eye or trout. After fighting it for what feels like forever he lands a nasty carp in the 8-9 pound range. Still hilarious, but not quite as rewarding.
Aren't us humans funny when it comes to carp? We go fishing for a fight, a lot of times not even planning on bringing anything home. We set the hook on a "monster", we totally enjoy the thrill of a fantastic fight, but as soon as we see the bronzeback we all moan and complain it is a carp. Don't get me wrong, I despise carp for what they have done to our waters but you do have to admit the fight is good. Suffice it to say that this particular carp fought it's last fight.
Starvy is awesome, only second to Powell in my books. Let's get some more bows in there but not too many that it effects the eyes!
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Re: [SBennett] Starvation 9-12-12 - Jmaze - 08-14-2012
I love the Starvey for all those reasons above, but the people... Eek. Some trips have had me red with rage because of all the "idiot" power squadron folk. As Tubedude noted the eye candy is refreshing, and the hotter the weather the smaller the... Clothing gets... Or maybe it was reference to the economy and cost of... Clothing..
Anyways Starvey Steelies as tubedude refers to are a GREAT bi-catch to the stick fighting walleyes in comparison.
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Re: [SBennett] Starvation 9-12-12 - LordoftheFlies - 08-14-2012
[quote SBennett]Let's get some more bows in there but not too many that it effects the eyes![/quote]
Too late. They're already having an impact, IMO. Clearly the trout are flourishing in there, but in my limited experience the walleye are getting smaller. I don't believe that's a coincidence. I just don't understand why we have to have another "trout fishery" just up the highway from Strawberry.
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Re: [LordoftheFlies] Starvation 9-12-12 - SBennett - 08-14-2012
I don't disagree the eyes do seem to be a little smaller but they are there in great numbers. Do you really believe the trout are to blame, I am on the fence on this until I learn a little more. Granted, the bows are consuming crawdads that could have ended up in the bellies of eyes but I am just not sure of the effect. In my extremely limited experience the bows occupy a niche that should not really effect the eyes much IF kept from an exploding population. Hence, sterile rainbows.
Maybe we can get a biologist to weigh in on this and help educate us? I know TD has sent a request for information in to the DWR, I just hope the DWR has a great answer.
As far as the motorheads ruining the fishing, I couldn't agree more. I am sure they are convinced we are ruining their fun time. We only have so much surface water and it is getting tougher to share. Just be glad Jordanelle was built or else Starvy and DC would be even more of a zoo than they are now.
In fact, it begs a question even I am afraid to answer: When are we going to go to odd/even days of lake usage. By that I mean odd days wakeless on the entire lake, even days anything goes? I am only 43 and boated my entire life. I even owned a boat when I was 17 in high school and took it on weekends and camped/boated on my own.
I have seen a drastic change, in HP and attitudes. I don't want to see this regulation but things get more and more tense every year. I thought for sure the first lake to start this would be Pineview. We are so lucky to have the water in Utah that we have. The fishing is even better! Let's go!!!
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Re: [SBennett] Starvation 9-12-12 - SBennett - 08-15-2012
Anyone learned anything else about possible future bow stockings in Starvy?
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Re: [SBennett] Starvation 9-12-12 - TubeDude - 08-15-2012
[cool][#0000ff]I have sent requests for input to a couple of DWR folks...so far without reply. I'll keep on it.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]My feelings and observations are that the rainbows are operating mostly at a different level than the walleyes...and are not a significant deterrent to walleye recruitment or growth. Sure, they both have lots of small crawdads in their gut right now, but as long as they are all feeding well...what's the problem? [/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]On an ongoing basis the rainbows cruise and feed in the upper part of the water column. There is a healthy crop of zooplankton and other invertebrates in Starvation that helps produce big healthy bows with bright red flesh. Walleyes feed lower down and on perch fry and other small fish when they can get them. The abundant perch population produces fast quantities of Wallie Chow every year. No longer the numbers of once abundant chubs but plenty of toothsome perch. Most of the bigger walleyes I keep and fillet have remnants of perch...up to about 8 inches at times.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]The "flip side" is that trout are commonly caught on the bottom while feeding on baby perch or bottom-dwelling invertebrates...and walleyes are frequently caught at mid depth over deep water. Why? Because perch fry move up in the water column to feed on the zooplankton and the predators follow. I have seen many schools of bigger perch and walleyes in and around schools of tiny tykes on sonar. And I have caught uncounted walleyes while pulling bubble and fly rigs for trout or slow trolling spinners less than 15 feet deep.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]I have fished Starvation since the 1970s and have seen it "evolve" through its different phases. I tend to disagree with those who blame the rainbows for all the small walleyes. I personally caught more small ones and fewer larger ones before the bows. Yes, there are a lot more smaller ones than larger ones...always. But the nature of walleyes is to be more hungry and aggressive while young and then to change habitat and feeding habits as they grow older...and smarter.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]Those who doubt the numbers need to change their fishing patterns. During the summer they need to fish at night and use big baits...or troll big crankbaits after dark both near shore and offshore in shallower water. The big fish are feeding but not as often. They raid a pile of night-dormant perch, quickly eat their fill and then lay on the bottom and burp until their next glut. The young ones are like human teenagers...always hungry and they will eat anything that doesn't eat them first. That's why everybody catches more seegars than gators.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]I personally believe there is plenty of room in the food chain for a carefully maintained population of sterile rainbows. They eat different groceries...for the most part...and they definitely provide super fishing for a lot of folks that just can't seem to dial in the big perch or walleyes.[/#0000ff]
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Re: [TubeDude] Starvation 9-12-12 - WET1 - 08-15-2012
Couldn't agree more TD! I have seen trmendous changes in the condition of the walleyes in Starvation over the past 4 years. Starvation is a VERY healthy fishery right now. If you don't think so ask the DWR what their gill net survey data looks like. Once the walleye reach the 15 inch mark now they are borderline obese! I have caught several 21 inchers this year that weigh between 4 and 4.5 lbs on a IFGA certified scale. I caught a 23 - 1/4" fish this last weekend that weighed exactly 6 -1/8 lbs. I saw a fish caught that was 23.5" long that weighed 6.5 lbs. These fish have huge guts and are very thick clear through to their tails. Just a couple years ago a 21 inch fish was a 3 pound fish.
You are right, there are still plenty of bigger walleye in Starvation they are just much harder to catch now because the perch population gives them so much feed that they do not have to be in search of prey all the time. The bigger fish seem to not only be feeding more actively at night (which is normal for 'eyes) but they also seem to spend an aweful lot of time laying around or suspended over deep water. There are a handful of excellent walleye anglers that are catching allot of big fish up there but they've adapted and developed the when, where, and how to do it.
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Re: [TubeDude] Starvation 9-12-12 - Gemcityslayer - 08-15-2012
Great points as always TD, hard to argue with your logic.
My question is what size do they stock trout @ on average?
If they are stocking 4-8" trout, heck, that in and of itself is good for the eyes.
Predators love freshly stocked "stockers".
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Re: [Gemcityslayer] Starvation 9-12-12 - TubeDude - 08-15-2012
[cool][#0000ff]Still waiting for something definitive. But you are right about small ones being favored by walleyes. The ones in Deer Creek seem to like them...including some over 12 inches. Big wallies like finless freddies.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]The first stocking report listed them as being put in as 6 inchers. They grew quickly and topped the 14 inch mark by the end of their first winter. The next year there was another crop of 12 to 13 inch fish in the fall and I suspect they were planted at about the same size they plant in Deer Creek...10 to 11 inches. Each fall and winter some new small ones show up...from somewhere. And by summer they are feisty 15s...growing to 19 inches or bigger by their second winter.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]It will be interesting to get the real scoop.[/#0000ff]
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Re: [TubeDude] Starvation 9-12-12 - WET1 - 08-16-2012
I talked to a DWR guy up there late last fall and he told me they are stocking "catchable size" so that they don't get hit with so much predation. I think generally catchable size is 10 to 12 inches as defined by the fisheries folks.
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