Catfish help

[bornfishin]

Any advice is helpful, where do I start with these creatures. Never tried for them.[bobdumb]
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[FishKillr]

They are great Fun! I would check out [url "http://www.bigfishtackle.com/forum/Utah_Fishing_Forum_C55/Utah_Fishing_General_F58/gforum.cgi?post=662618;forum_view=forum_view_collapsed;page=unread#unread"]this post[/url]. It contains a ton of good info, and if you go a few posts down there is Tubedudes post with his PDF write ups attached. That will have all you ever wanted to know about Cats n more.
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[TubeDude]

[cool][#0000ff]Your profile states that you live in Bountiful. I'm guessing you might want to try Willard Bay. Here is my most recent "cat-torial" writeup.[/#0000ff]
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[toadly]

Nice article TD.
bornfishin,
Read TD's stuff. He got me going on cats and now I have caught a ton of them. Read his article listed in this thread then go to the archives there are even more that give up good info on many other spots here in Utah.
Good Luck![cool]
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[TubeDude]

[cool][#0000ff]Thanks Bro.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]PMing you the semi-finished writeup on Wipers. Would like to get your feedback on it. Also got a new one on fishing the north marina. Not gonna put everything out online. [/#0000ff]
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[bornfishin]

Thanks for all the info I'll have to give it a shot
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[DannyNoonan]

TD-

I am always silently appreciative of your well written reports and info in your regular fishing posts, but in the last week I've read your PDF write ups on catfish and white bass in Utah Lake and now this one on Willard today, and it prompted me to log in and gush for a minute about how great all the info you are willing to share with all of us is, and how lucky we are to have you..

Thanks !!!

I grew up like many around here as mainly a trout fisherman and mostly catch and release on flies, but in this era of $4 and climbing gas I'm more and more prone to keep some trips closer to home, and to places where I can bring home a few meals worth of fillets to offset the expense. Over the winter I beefed up my collection deep frying equipment and cant wait to put it to use!!

This seems like the perfect post to hijack and ask a question that has kind of been a lifelong debate between me and a few guys I know..

How do you hook your minnows and/or cut bait?

I have always been inclined to thread the hook behind the head, pull it all the way through, then insert the hook again thru the tail.. My thought being that any motion then makes the minnow move forward, problem is it often forces the minnow to bend almost in a circle..

Another friend SWEARS that fish prefer to eat dead minnows head first and therefore goes first thru the tail and then inserts the hook just behind the gills..

And yet another friend (grew up fishing live minnows in Minnesota) says the best way is a single hook thru the middle just below the dorsal fin keeps the minnow more upright and more natural looking, this really is only feasible on really fresh minnows. Once they have been frozen the flesh is too soft and the hook often just pulls thru the spine (My experience)

I always double hook strips of cutbait also..

So I'm curious as to how you guys feel is the best.

Thanks again
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[GEEZER]

Git ol TubeDude ta show ya. He's got it figgered out & I can testify to that!
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[Boatloadakids]

Big Plus 1 on Dannynoon's comments about TD. Hard to find a more helpful guy anywhere. I'm lookin' for the day he finally combines all of his write-ups into a single volume so I can get on his mailing list.

Almost cat time!!
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[TubeDude]

[cool][#0000ff]Thanks. I appreciate your appreciation.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]There are a lot of variables in how to rig a minnow and/or cut bait. Depends a lot on the size and type of minnow...and freshness...and on the size hook (and type) you are using. Then it further depends on how active the fish are and how they are taking the bait. Covering all the permutations could fill a book. Maybe I'll go there sometime.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]First of all, I use plain ring-eye hooks...not circle hooks. And I seldom use larger than about size 2 unless I am fishing big baits for big fish. I probably use size 4 Eagle Claw #84 more than any other, but good "octopus" style hooks are good too.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]Good fresh chub minnows are usually pretty firm and you can get by with hooking them through the gill collar...as pictured below. When fish are "gulp and go" they will grab the head and boogie. You can set the hook quickly and usually go bendo.[/#0000ff]
[#0000ff][inline "HOOKING CHUBS.jpg"][/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]Sometimes the fish are finicky..."pop and drop". They might pick up and drop the bait a couple of times before getting serious. That can tear the bait off the hook before you have a chance to do a lip piercing. If I am using softer baits or getting the "treatment" I prefer to hook the bait back near the tail...sometimes just under the skin, like in the picture below. Other times I wrap the hook around the spine to provide better holding.[/#0000ff]
[inline "CHUB HOOKING.jpg"]
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[#0000ff]I have conducted a lot of experiments on various ways of hooking minnows and I have found no detectable difference in bite ratios. The key elements are keeping the bait on the hook and in the fishes' mouth long enough to make a good hook set. [/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]When I fish cut baits and strip baits I usually use the same size hooks but I hook it only once through the bait at one end or the other. That keeps the hook point more open for setting the hook and also helps the bait to flutter a bit if you lift and drop it. In the pic below you can see the remnants of a piece of skinless carp meat strip. That is about the size and shape I use most...and have caught some of my biggest cats on smaller pieces of carp meat. [/#0000ff]
[#0000ff][inline "CARP CUTLET.jpg"] [/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]They will mess around with a larger piece and will swim off with it, but may not have the hook inside their mouths when you try to set the hook. They snort in the whole bait if you use a smaller piece. The main problem with smaller pieces is dealing with bullheads and white bass.[/#0000ff]
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[HATH]

Nightcrawlers with a split shot a foot above the hook never fails.
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[h0yt3r]

Wow TD, that is some awesome information. I used to fish Yuba with my g-pa as a kid and caught all kinds of kitties there, but haven't spent the time at the Bay to figure it out. I've lived within 5 miles of Willard Bay my entire life and can count on one hand the number of fish I've caught there. This post gives me some hope and motivation and I'm ready to get the boat on the water and try some of your techniques. Thanks again for that great post.
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[TubeDude]

[cool][#0000ff]Glad you like it. Good luck.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]Just a word of warning though. Sometimes when you are fishing for kitties those silly wipers and walleyes wanna play and you have to deal with a few of them...and vice versa. They all hit a lot of the same baits and lures.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]Let me know if you want any info on Wipers and I can PM you my early draft.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]Sadly, Yuba is a very poor shadow of what it used to be. I too used to get a lot of nice cats there but no more.[/#0000ff]
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[h0yt3r]

I'm definitely not opposed to getting a hold of some wipers or eyes and would appreciate any info you're willing to pass on. I caught a nice wiper there last fall just happened upon a boil while were out with the kids. Dumb luck, but a great fight.
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[TubeDude]

[cool][#0000ff]Nice fish. Appropriate . A lot of guys have to make a trip to the emergency room after their first wiper...to get that surgically removed.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]PDF file on the way.[/#0000ff]
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[12inchlunker]

[fishon]
TD is the man for sure!!!!
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[Voodohound]

TD, why have I heard of the bad rap about fish consumption at Utah Lake because of contaminants. I believe I've seen on the State Fishing Report website that they advise that you don't consume more than 4 oz of fish from Utah Lake per week. Is that true or are they overreacting? As I read your article I got the impression that you have no problem eating fish from UL.

Thanks again for all the great information!!!
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[TubeDude]

[cool][#0000ff]The best advice I can offer is to never take the advice of others without doing your own "due diligence". There are various published reports on the water quality of Utah Lake but there are still some lingering concerns about the terrible abuse suffered by the lake back in the days of Geneva Steel...and it was ugly. I am attaching one of the chapters I am putting together on Utah lake that touches on the former contamination and at least one of the published reports of more recent water studies.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]In a nutshell, Utah Lake is probably cleaner and safer for fish consumption than many of our more[/#0000ff]
[#0000ff]"pristine" mountain lakes...especially in terms of mercury pollution. Utah Lake HAS NO MERCURY PROBLEM...but that is what a lot of people cite when they talk about fish contamination from that pond. In tests on all species of fish from Utah Lake, NONE were found to contain elevated levels of mercury. [url "http://www.fishadvisories.utah.gov/"]UTAH FISH ADVISORIES[/url][/#0000ff]

[#0000ff]On the other hand, both carp and large channel cats were found to contain levels of PCBs above an arbitrarily established "safe" level...and the standard advisories were put in place. i.e. no pregnant women are supposed to catch carp or catfish on Utah Lake and eat more than 10 pounds per meal...or whatever. [/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]There are no warnings about bullhead cats, white bass, walleyes, crappies, bluegills or perch.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]And, if you are still concerned, there are ways of preparing even large catfish to remove a high percentage of accumulated PCBs. The main locations are in the guts and in the fatty tissues. Properly filleting, removal of red oily flesh and innards and deep frying will all remove a great deal of the PCB. Ditto for smoking. [/#0000ff]

[#0000ff]I and several other concerned Utah Lake fans on the board have continuosly tried to find more information on what actually constitutes "safe" levels of PCBs in fish...and what would be the expected consequences of somebody over-consuming fish with such elevated levels. Everything I have found is suitably vague.[/#0000ff]

[#0000ff]Utah Lake is not the "Love Canal". It is not a toxic waste dump and has been greatly improved over the last decade plus since Geneva Steel shut down. It is a shallow lake and gets heavy natural flushes each year...leaving only traces of former nastiness in the deepest levels of sediment.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]If it were not for the heavy population of carp, Utah Lake would be a much cleaner and clearer water, with more of the natural aquatic vegetation to both provide good nursery habitat for other species and to help continuously clean and refresh the water.[/#0000ff]
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[lavaman]

Hey TD! That is an informative .pdf thank you for posting that.
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[wormsinker]

you should right your own book titled " FISHIN THE WILLY "[]
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