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Bird dogs
#21
Hunt em early heh... As soon as i have her settled in her new living situation we will get out there. The setter is taking a minute to warm up to an energetic puppy thats going to dwarf him. He is coming around though.
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#22
I have recently been looking into a flat coated retriever. Look them up. They are a limited population dog, but from all I have read and heard they are great for both upland game and waterfowl.

Good luck on your search.
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#23
those are some pretty dogs. they look like a cross between a setter and a lab
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#24
I've never duck hunted and stopped upland game hunting a few years ago and miss it a lot. I've tried the pheasant farms, but it just isn't the same if you grew up hunting wild pheasants. That said, I've had two bird dogs (still have one, though she's semi-retired!). Neither of which recieved any formal training other than me taking them out hunting.

The first was a black lab names Boogus. (Boojus). A great family dog, and was a wonderful "flusher" and retriever, but would not point to save her life. Once a shot was fired however, she retrieved every single bird and had an uncanny ability to find downed birds. She would go into the deepest junk, or swim in the coldest swamps to retrieve the birds. She died at about 15 years old, and I don't recall her ever pointing a bird out once. I never took her duck hunting, though I think she would have been an excellent duck dog.

We then bought a Weimereiner. This dog has the most natural pointing ability I've ever seen in a dog and she is a joy to go out hunting with. Once out in the field her whole demeaner changes and she is all business. She can find, track and point in all conditions and is an excellent pointer. However...she is NOT a retriever. In fact, once she has done her job and has pointed out the bird, and it flushes....she watches to make sure you hit it (and gives you a crusty look if you miss), but then it's as if that bird is now history, and she is off sniffing out the next point. I've tried to make her retrieve birds, but she will have nothing to do with them. Her name is Ginger. She's 10 years old now and her last trip out was a couple years ago. I enjoy taking her to the pheasant farms just to see her work, but shooting those tame birds are no fun for me.

I think if I could cross both of my dogs somehow, it would be the ultimate single dog to have...OR...just have one of each and take them both! I DO believe that pointing and/or retrieving/water use has to be inbred as I have had little luck teaching dogs new tricks. (Old dogs AND new dogs). Both of these dogs were/are good swimmers, although the Weimer just goes in to swim, or to sniff out ducks while they are swimming, but she WILL NOT go into the water to retrieve a downed bird. The Black Lab was an excellent water retriever however. (We shot many a pheasant that landed in the water, and she always just went right in and got them)

My Son in law and my daughter own Llewellyns. They have two of them. A male named Smokey and a female named Cabela. They are pheasant hunting machines, and I know they point, as I've seen pictures, but I don't know how they do on the retrieval part of the game and not sure how they swim.

...Curiously, the black labs mother WAS in fact a Weimerener...but she never pointed like like her mother did. It would be cool if you could just take two dogs with good traits and breed them together to produce one with both traits...but it doesn't always work that way. I have seen Weimereners that retrieve also...and I guess I could have trained her harder/better to do so, but Ginger just never showed any interest at all, and was so good at pointing that I overlooked her retrieving pitfalls.

I'd probably stick with a lab for pure waterfowl hunting. I never hunted ducks, but the black lab would have been excellent for that type of hunting, since pointing is not usually necessary when duck hunting.

Randy
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I used to N.ot have E.nough T.ime O.ff to go fishing.  Then I retired.  Now I have less time than I had before. Sheesh.
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#25
I actually looked into the breeding deal to accomplish what ^^^^^is talking about. Wanted to breed my chessie with a visla that a buddy had that is amazing. In talking with breeders you don't get good cross of traits for a few generations. The first gen won't be a good combonation, part of the litter will lean to wards one parent almost 100% and the rest will lean to the other parent.
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#26
I have yet to see a dog that is the ultimate for both worlds that is upland and water foul. I have seen several dogs that can do both but not to the extremes of each. I've never seen a dog that can out swim/retrieve a lab other then a chessy. and i have never seen a dog that can match the nose and endurance of a lewellyn. I'm thinking i own a male and female of both extremes........ How bout Chessellyn setting retriever.
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#27
That's what I was thinking.The pics of flatcoats reminded me of my lab/ irish setter mix I had as a teen.
Pup peed in the unfinished basement once the first day we got her. I said "no" and took her outside and her house training was mastered. Never had a dog that was so easy to train in anyway since.
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#28
Have you found a breeder in Utah? those are some seriously pretty dogs! never heard of them before
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#29
The closest breeders are in CA, and ID. Not sure which one I will get a pup from, but I know I will get one eventually.
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#30
Had to bring this post back to life! Years later here is the result Ultimate Bird hunting pups! These should be fantastic upland and waterfowl dogs. 2 males and 5 females. Sire is a Llewelyn setter dam is a Chesapeake bay retriever. They are for sale. Message me if interested
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#31
This is what I hunt with.

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#32
Cute pups. I'm a GSP lover but would love to know how these pups turn out to be hunters. Please post with any updates
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#33
[quote BagABigOne]Cute pups. I'm a GSP lover but would love to know how these pups turn out to be hunters. Please post with any updates[/quote]

x2

Me and my ole man went in on a chessie that has been absolutely amazing for both upland and waterfowl but that was up north where we needed her for cold weather. Down here in UT I'm leery of going with a chessie because of the heat. She struggled with upland when it was hot.
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#34
They are turning out pretty good! Think most will be dominantly Chessy


Still have 4 left for sale
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#35
I think this is what a lot of people do not realize when they are going through the designer dog phase.

If you look at the pudelpointer (A breed not a cross) it took a mix of 11 Pudels and 80 Pointers were used during the first 30 years to achieve the desired traits and results.

Now, we just mix a lab and a pointer and hope for the best.

If you want desired traits, it takes careful selection and breeding to obtain.
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#36
very true.

But I have a golden doodle that is multi generation now. 2nd breeding cycle on mom and 3rd on the dad's side. He is smaller, about 40 pounds, like i wanted and very smart. Generally easier to train then any of my labs have been. Although he is more sensitive to hard corrections. He is really doing well for 4 months and retrieves to hand, comes when called even when "hunting" or playing. Overall a great dog, and I think the breed will become a recognized breed as it is already very popular.
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#37
I had one for 8 years, best dog I've owned for upland game. He liked to swim, but was not good on waterfowl. I would caution crossing with a lab if you do a lot of chukar hunting. My experience with labs in chukar country is that their frame is too big for their smaller feet to handle the lava rock type environments. Watched a friend ruin a monster black lab. Hunted him 3 days in the rocks where he developed problems with his front legs that he never recovered from. He was the best waterfowl dog I've ever hunted behind up until that time. I would just buy a lab, give your Llewellyn some company. I have a good friend who is a awesome dog trainer, lives in Weiser, and could give you some ideas. let me know and I can send you his contact info. He's trained dogs for over 50 years.
good luck
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#38
(12-04-2012, 05:39 PM)pookiebar Wrote: I have recently been looking into a flat coated retriever. Look them up. They are a limited population dog, but from all I have read and heard they are great for both upland game and waterfowl.

Good luck on your search.
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I have a Silver lab. Now I know there are some die hard Lab owners that say " no such labs" Well there is... Cross between a chocolate lab &
Weimaraner. He has both upland and waterfowl blood line. Smart and easy to train..
All in all... GREAT DOG !

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[Image: 20191211-150110.jpg]
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#39
I grew up with German Shorthairs. My dad and uncle both had them. And I had a couple after I grew up. I have never hunted waterfowl much, don't like the taste of duck. But in 2002 I got my first Weimeraner. I found that they love the water and can out swim a Labrador. I'm not kidding. They are completely at home in the water and could literally swim all day long. I was metal detecting in Nevada once and I stopped at a small lake to let Sage cool off. There were carp jumping all over and Sage stayed out in that little lake all afternoon trying to catch one of those carp. My Sage, once chased a beaver all the way across Blackfoot Reservoir. And chased another way down the Snake River and took two hours to find her way back. She never caught the beavers.They would play with her. Sage died in January 2015 of lymphoma, from Round Up probably. She was my best friend and it was worse than losing my mother or dad. The only way I could get through it was to get another Weimer puppy. My new dog Dakota, is a certified dock dog. And just like Sage, a great retriever. She is my new constant companion. And goes every where with me.
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#40
Forgot to post Dakotas photo. [Image: IMG-20181020-105336.jpg]
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