Catfish Contest Thoughts

[SkunkedAgain]

Jim contacted me about this summers catfish contest, sure appreciate his interest and willingness to help out this year.  I think we need to push off the starting gun until April 1st this year.  Might be lucky if the snow is even melted by then in Cache Valley.  Pretty sure the mid March start would be a little earlier than necessary, although I know some of you will be catching catfish during March, but I think it's best to wait until both teams have a chance to catch fish before we begin... It's a really long contest anyway and for the most part, very few winning fish have ever been caught in March... Not saying it's not possible, just less likely...

Next question for you, what can we do to add more interest in the contest this year.  Seems like last year our northern team almost fell to less than the four people needed to post a team score.  I know down south there seems to be more excitement and a lot of folks catching great fish.  Maybe it was just a down year for the north on fish size, I know I didn't find many over 27 last year... Do you think the contest is too long? Should we focus on something different?  If there isn't an interest in the contest we don't need to have one.  But if you like the contest, please let us know.  If you have suggestions, please let us know and we can look into making changes to the  rules if needed... If you're good with how we've been doing it in the past, we can do it like that one more time... Thanks for all the years of support on this contest we're coming up on year number 9 I believe.  I'll have to check my records, but I think 2014 was the first one I was involved with... Anyone ready for a torquey fight?  It's almost time for the power to return... Later Jeff

[Piscophilic]

Hi Jeff,

As you know, I still love the contest and hope we can increase interest and participation. If our objective is to have something fun for as many BFT folks as we can, I think we may need to shift the focus a little or increase the recognition in some way. It seems like the contest works for the hard core guys (guilty) but the last few years you have to have 3 cats over 30 inches within the first month or two or just quit. I think for many who just have fun catching cats it feels like the contest is over for them after the first month or 2.

To keep more people interested, there needs to be some hope of recognition in addition to or different from the current top 3 fish of the contest period.

Like I said, I like it as is and it has caused me to learn a lot over the years I've participated, but it may not be the best format for maximizing participation. I'm certainly willing to support changes that cause more folks to have fun with it.

[big_griggs]

South just Rises every Year must tell you something about the caliber of Fisherman down here. LOL

[SkunkedAgain]

Here's an idea that I'm going to steal from Ron and Jim, on the ice challenge we ended up having a drawing every two weeks for those that made an entry in the period.  They were some really nice prizes too.  It seemed to increase the activity on the ice challenge.  Do you think that contest participants would be more interested in the contest if there was a chance to win a prize from their participation rather than just achieving excellence?  How this would work would be if you made an entry meaning you filled one of your 3 slots, or bumped one of your lower scores, then you would qualify for the drawing that month.  We will have a random number generator pick the winner from those contestants that qualified..  Then send out the prizes... We will likely be looking for some good prizes to put into the contest so it's something most fisher persons would like...  So if you're interested in helping with prizes we would love the support... If we decide to try this... We think monthly will be the best period to use since this is such a long contest... Plus it will give chances for anyone to win, not just the two or three that takes home the big bragging rights... Let me know what you think about this idea?  Thanks Jeff

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South just Rises every Year must tell you something about the caliber of Fisherman down here.  LOL

Or the number of fishermen and women down there... One or two years on top doesn't mean you have a monopoly on the team trophy... North still has far more wins... Although we need some real catters to return to the contest, I don't do a very good job trying to pull up the number 3 position, they need to bench me and get somebody with skills on the team... Later J

[Mooseman75]

Here's an idea that I'm going to steal from Ron and Jim, on the ice challenge we ended up having a drawing every two weeks for those that made an entry in the period.  They were some really nice prizes too.  It seemed to increase the activity on the ice challenge.  Do you think that contest participants would be more interested in the contest if there was a chance to win a prize from their participation rather than just achieving excellence?  How this would work would be if you made an entry meaning you filled one of your 3 slots, or bumped one of your lower scores, then you would qualify for the drawing that month.  We will have a random number generator pick the winner from those contestants that qualified..  Then send out the prizes... We will likely be looking for some good prizes to put into the contest so it's something most fisher persons would like...  So if you're interested in helping with prizes we would love the support... If we decide to try this... We think monthly will be the best period to use since this is such a long contest... Plus it will give chances for anyone to win, not just the two or three that takes home the big bragging rights... Let me know what you think about this idea?  Thanks Jeff

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South just Rises every Year must tell you something about the caliber of Fisherman down here.  LOL

Or the number of fishermen and women down there... One or two years on top doesn't mean you have a monopoly on the team trophy... North still has far more wins... Although we need some real catters to return to the contest, I don't do a very good job trying to pull up the number 3 position, they need to bench me and get somebody with skills on the team... Later J

I kind of like the idea of the prize every month drawing. I know I go and I may not post a3rd fish even because it won't count but that would keep me fighting for bigger fish and posting. 

Also Devon is 16 turns 17 in August, is he a youth or no?

[catchinon]

I think the April 1 start is fine--gives us a space to catch our breath between the end of the ice contest and then. I like the idea of a drawing for prizes. I also think that we should have a prize for the rookie of the year. I'm not sure we have hyped it as much the last couple of years as we have in the past. Let's get some buzz going and maybe have a gallery of great fish and fisherpersons of the past. I think if you advertise hard you could get participants to contribute some prizes like we did a couple of years ago at the end-of-season meet-up in November. I ended up with a very nice Ambaseur reel and everybody got something nice. Here's another idea. If we can get those who would want to, we could raffle off guided trips with some of the veteranos. Who wouldn't love a day out on the lake with Pisco or some other stars? That's how I learned what I do know about catching those wiley fish. We could also do some hype around the Flotilla which should happen at Utah Lake about the time the fishing starts getting really good. I think giving recognition on the main board would also promote interest and help swell our numbers.

[Cowboypirate]

Cookie and I were definitely absent. But not from lack of wanting to participate. The last year or so was been really wierd. I can't tell you how may trips we had planned that we had to cancel. Same with ice fishing. I mean I bought all new gear and it has been sitting. Everyone, I suppose, has that timeframe where crap just keeps saying hello and alters everything. Anyway, we plan on being more active in general this year and being part of the contest, too.

As for ideas - we love cats, but we love to fish for a lot of species and plan to spend more time camping this summer which means fly rod and slimers. I like the concept of a multi species contest but it did not seem to catch wind in the sails when we tried it. Not sure that it would if we tried again but I know our fishing this year will be more diverse in targeting.

[TubeDude]

Pirate's reply kinda reinforces an idea I have been codgertatin' on.  That is to make the annual (open water) contest for all species...with categories for the individual species...and a series of prizes for each category...biggest, smallest, etc.  That way all members could participate on their own level and not worry about being shut out of the "elite" catfish thing.

I claim at least some of the credit/blame for getting more folks out chasin' catkind.  And I dearly enjoy the hand to fin combat with those big ol' ugly whiskery fish.  Love eatin' 'em too.  But like most on this board I am an all tackle and multi-species kinda guy.  And the past couple of years I have not really put in as much time and effort on the cats...as reflected by my lower places on the cat contest.

It's great that individual members are willing (crazy) enough to take on the responsibilities of administering and maintaining our fishing contests.  But if we made it a multi-species thing we could have different members in charge of keeping up the standings on only their part of the contest.  More participation and possibly more interest.???  And if we promoted our contests through Sportsmans and other outlets it would probably generate some new members too.  We been slippin'.

[SkunkedAgain]

Great ideas everyone, Let's keep the ideas going and dig deeper into how we would implement some of these.  I know I was all crazy about the multi species contest because of my love for the ice challenge, but we were shot down pretty hard a couple years back when we thought about trying it then... I hope the interest is there to expand things, but I will for sure need more help managing this... Jim has offered his help and we could also use some help with the prize packages...  One other question, how would you recommend getting Sportsmans and other tackle dealers to join in helping sponsor the contest?  Is this something we would do store by store or try to get a corporate deal going?  I know CAL Ranch has always been a great supporter with prizes for our contests and they seem to be less corporate structured so they are easier to work with... Smith and Edwards will hopefully be willing to help... Pretty sure if we market this correctly, it could result in more BFT members and participation... Lots of great ideas everyone....

Justin, I think the rule reads if they are 16 at the beginning of the contest they qualify as youth, but I'll have to check that you know how good my memory is lately... 

Lance do you think you and Cookie might be able to help with the contest management if we expand?  Thanks J

Craig, I love the idea of "guided trips" or draw a partner trips.... Let's see if folks would be willing to do that? 

Pat, as you can see I've incorporated a lot of your thoughts throughout my rant... I kind of wonder if the ice challenge format might work for some of the ideas you have presented, and it may help fill what others have suggested as well...  Here's my reasoning for the ice challenge format:  There are too many species to do prizes for everything, however, in ice challenge we divide fish into 5 categories. Panfish, Trout, Bass, Predator and everything else...  If we had a prize for each category and then did a similar decathlon overall score winner that might be fun.  This would also give a way that if you only like trout or bass or catfish, you could concentrate on winning that category and not worry about the rest and we could market prizes to each category depending on those interested in that category... (wonder if I'm making any sense?)  Before I go too nuts developing this let's take a breather and see if anyone is interested in this type format...  I'm not wanting to kill the catfish contest, and I expect that it can continue within this same format, but not sure if we want to stick to the 3 top fish score... I need your thoughts on this I don't want to go away from a classic, but I have heard from many that I've talked to, that they don't like to be only focused on catfish...  Let me know your thoughts.... Jeff

[TubeDude]

Pat, as you can see I've incorporated a lot of your thoughts throughout my rant... I kind of wonder if the ice challenge format might work for some of the ideas you have presented, and it may help fill what others have suggested as well...  Here's my reasoning for the ice challenge format:  There are too many species to do prizes for everything, however, in ice challenge we divide fish into 5 categories. Panfish, Trout, Bass, Predator and everything else...  If we had a prize for each category and then did a similar decathlon overall score winner that might be fun.  This would also give a way that if you only like trout or bass or catfish, you could concentrate on winning that category and not worry about the rest and we could market prizes to each category depending on those interested in that category... (wonder if I'm making any sense?)  Before I go too nuts developing this let's take a breather and see if anyone is interested in this type format...  I'm not wanting to kill the catfish contest, and I expect that it can continue within this same format, but not sure if we want to stick to the 3 top fish score... I need your thoughts on this I don't want to go away from a classic, but I have heard from many that I've talked to, that they don't like to be only focused on catfish...  Let me know your thoughts.... Jeff

The original catfish contest started out being a way to introduce catfishing to more people...and to help everybody learn more about this species and to appreciate them more.  It was almost too successful...until the shine wore off a bit.  Still some hard core catters and they remain dedicated and competitive.  But I doubt anyone would really object to expanding the scope of the contest...as long as there is a defined niche for the cat chasers. 

Ultimately, this forum is about helping everybody learn more about their fave fishing pursuits and to improve their overall success rate...regardless of preferred tackle, water or species.  It is going to take some diagramming and planning to define the categories, rules, reporting, status maintaining, prizes, etc.  But I think the end result (more members and happier members) will justify the efforts.

[SkunkedAgain]

Thanks Pat, I can see the potential... Kind of depends if folks are interested in contests or not, I know a lot aren't.  I like contests for pushing me to learn new things and trying something that I haven't done before.  I've found a lot of really fun things as a result of trying to fill a category and I think that is a lot more fun than trying to keep pushing to catch the biggest, although that can be fun too, but I like learning new ways to catch fish and I think the tug is my drug and it doesn't always have to be the hardest pull to be exciting... Sometimes the gill on a fly is pretty dang fun too... I hope the group is ready for a larger scope to try something different.  I wonder about doing short term contests within a contest, like maybe the most species caught on a certain day, or biggest panfish weekend or something like that... Maybe those short term shootouts will keep folks paying attention throughout the summer... Hope I have time to join in the fun... farming habit always ruins my summer fun... I make big plans and then get too busy to enjoy them... That's why we'll get a good group to help us make this work... Thanks for the input and knowledge you add to our conversations...  Jeff

[Jig-fisher]

I've enjoyed the cat contest, but now I'm working in an area away from the mighty Bear River.  I also like to fish for a lot of different species and would enjoy a change. I'm still going to fish for cats, but also walleye, wipers, smallmouth, gills, crappie, tiger muskies, trout, kokes, or whatever will bite. Might as well be able to enter some of those fish as well. I like it.

[SkunkedAgain]

Thanks Paul, I appreciate your comments, helps me understand more folks are thinking the same thing... Thank you... J

[Piscophilic]

Just a comment on Craig's suggestion: 

[font="Open Sans", sans-serif]Here's another idea. If we can get those who would want to, we could raffle off guided trips with some of the veteranos. Who wouldn't love a day out on the lake with Pisco or some other stars?[/font]

One of the things I like best is taking people out, especially when they are just starting to learn, so I would be glad to do that.

[joatmon]

A few observations - BFT participation is down overall (see charts below) and not sure if that is a product of an aging membership (not getting out as much), fewer members, website change, or D) all of the above. My guess is there is a need to expand membership to a younger audience. Not sure how to achieve that when competing with Facebook groups, etc. (Yes, I also belong to several Facebook fishing and ice fishing groups). 

I also see that commercial tournaments are continuing to grow. The sheer number of tournaments is up and thus participation must be robust.

Below are charts showing BFT contest (ice and cat) and forum (general and premium) participation over the last few years. I couldn't go back beyond the website change. Food for thought...

[SkunkedAgain]

Jim,
Thanks for the support on that part, I like that idea as well...
Brett,
Appreciate the charts that confirm what we have been suspecting.  You know I think we need to find our niche and do the best we can with it.  It reminds me of when the big box stores rolled into Cache Valley and a local appliance store could see the writing on the wall that the box stores would end up being able to sell appliances a lot cheaper than the small local retailer could.  So they focused on repairs and service calls... Turned out to be a great call for them, they are busier than ever, increased employment and pivoted well...  I think BFT has always been the educational type site where you can come and learn how to be better at fishing, where FB seems to be more of a look at me site showing off the catch, but not offering much help on how to do the same thing... Maybe that's just my take, but seems like if you ever ask a question of FB you get ridiculed or some kind of snarky answer.. So I think we need to exploit our strengths and make the best of them.. Maybe tying the contest into a partnership with local retailers might help us increase membership and they will see what BFT offers when they come for the contest...  Just a thought... Later J

[lavaman]

Alright, I'm back for the North. Been having too much fun chasing bass in my pontoon boat in recent years
If there's one thing that I think could be an improvement, and it's just a suggestion: Let's make the tourney not last as long as it usually lasts. I'm thinking more people would be interested if it's focused on say, a two or three month duration. Just my opinion of course.

Anyone agree or disagree, or indifferent?

[Cowboypirate]

Jeff, yes, Cookie and I would help with a summer contest.

[SkunkedAgain]

Jeff, yes, Cookie and I would help with a summer contest.

Thank you Lance, if we expand to a bigger contest i could really use some help... Thanks J

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Expert vs novice, been wondering about if we want to further complicate scoring?  Here's a thought to consider, what if we have an expert and novice score that would be figured by a 1 fish novice score, and/or a two fish average between the two fish size so if you get a 6" and a 36" channel cat your novice score would be 36 and expert score would be 21... This would give folks that want to focus on a species a chance to excel, where the accidental catch would do good on the novice score, but fade in the expert category.... Is that getting to complicated?  Or is it something of interest?  You could do the 3 fish score like we are used to with the catfish contest, it will be a big job for the score keepers, maybe we only have that on a handful of species... Just throwing out ideas and seeing what you think... Some might stick, some might stink... Later J

[SkunkedAgain]

So here's another thought to consider, several have mentioned the contest being too long and losing interest because it seems it's never going to end... What if we broke it into a spring and fall contest with a break in the middle without a contest so you could free fish without thinking about a contest???  Think about that and comment to your thoughts?