Fat Willard Wipers

[wiperhunter2]

Catching has been slow at Willard but the wipers that are being caught are some very fat fish. The bigger wiper in these pics was nearly 5 lb and as you can see in the pic very fat.
WH2
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[nebocreek]

Wow Curt... Those are some hogs! Looks like I may have to head up your way again soon.
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[JLW]

Nice fish Curt. The forage in there must be doing pretty good for them to have guts like that. The Eye`s should be thinking about putting on a food bag here pretty soon too. Fishon
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[CoyoteSpinner]

You ain't kidding. Chunky monkies!

Guess that 50/50 is working 100%

see any boil-age, or just dragging around?
No Eye's in the mix eh?

[wiperhunter2]

[quote nebocreek]Wow Curt... Those are some hogs! Looks like I may have to head up your way again soon.[/quote]
I'm planning on fishing Willard until ice on, so if you want to get out there again, I'd be willing to fish with you again but be warned, catching is slow. I had high hopes of seeing the wipers boil by now but the murky water is keeping that from happening. Yesterday would have been a perfect day for boils, little to no wind and shad on the surface. The bad thing, at least for catching wipers, is that the water temp has now dropped below 60*. I'm hoping the walleye bite will turn on soon, I think that will happen soon.
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[Jmaze]

I have said it once and I will say it again... There are no Walleye in Willard.... [:/] Maybe...
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[wiperhunter2]

[quote JLW]Nice fish Curt. The forage in there must be doing pretty good for them to have guts like that. The Eye`s should be thinking about putting on a food bag here pretty soon too. Fishon[/quote]
From what I saw yesterday, I'd say the small shad numbers have been reduced by 40% to 50% still big numbers in the lake but that will be good for the predators during the winter. The size of this years shad are between 1.5" and 3.5", I'm really surprised by the different in sizes. As we troll along the little shad are jumping out of the water, all around the boat, in areas where the shad numbers are high. With the large numbers of eyes that were caught this year, I'm surprised they haven't started chasing lures again, especially with lower water temps but it is likely because there are still big numbers of shad, still in the lake. My fingers are still crossed, that the eye bite will turn on soon.
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[rctalbot]

Those are some fatties! Nice!
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[wiperhunter2]

[quote CoyoteSpinner]You ain't kidding. Chunky monkies!

Guess that 50/50 is working 100%

see any boil-age, or just dragging around?
No Eye's in the mix eh?[/quote]

I haven't had any luck with the 50/50 method in almost a month now. Small cranks, like rattle traps, are what is working now. No boils. No eyes, since right after you and I were out. I'm heading up for the hunt tomorrow and next weekend, if no success tomorrow. It is suppose to be rainy the first part of next week and I'm going up to Bear lake for the Gill net servey on Thurs. After that, I'll be back at Willard and we can get out there and give it a try, just about any day you want.
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[toadly]

Glad to see your still getting out there. We should try it again another afternoon.
I will be heading to Mantua this afternoon to look for some Bass. Hope the water is clearer. Taking the flyrod to see if the trout will bite as well.[cool]
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[TubeDude]

[cool][#0000ff]Congrats on the piggies. [/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]I suspect that boils are over. Wipers are just not that active when the water goes to 60 or lower. [/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]I also suspect that the walleye feed is on...just not on silly fishermen's lures. If you caught any they would be full of shad eaten during the night before. But when they are choked with food they don't feed during the day.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]Also, there is likely to be another massive dieoff of the smallest shad very soon. They are more sensitive to the cold when water temps go below 55 degrees...and their food sources (zooplankton) drop off for the winter. Larger ones that hatched earlier in the delayed spawning season can find more aquatic invertebrates to survive on.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]During the big dieoff last year...in November...the terns were swooping all over the water at daybreak picking up the dead baby shad. Within an hour or so you would never know it happened. But lots of other skinny baby shad died and sunk to the bottom, where the catfish had a glut. It was tough to get cats to bite too...and the ones I caught all had bulging guts full of baby shad goo.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]Here is a pic of one of the floating dead shadlets I picked off the water last year. Probably can't see it too well but it is paper thin...absolutely anorexic. Those shad are normally about 3" by November and are less likely to survive the winter if they aren't.[/#0000ff]
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[CoyoteSpinner]

The pre-winter winter kill... so - many of your observations on Willard lean toward the notion the game fish are so dang full of bait fish, hardly yawning to grab a snack, puking them up all over... so are the anglers just dang lucky to snag one on a reaction maneuver?

Too bad we can't USE shad as bait - you could fully get in on that feeding frenzy eh? If they're scarfing up dead shad. But does mixing in a carp-minnow in the mix get some love?


So Curt- it's more the raps n cranks now, eh? Man - I got a set of jointed walleye divers with that puddle in mind.
If I can get ahead a bit - might be able to pull an afternoon soon.

[TubeDude]

[cool][#0000ff]Fishing is always about food...what the fish are eating, when and how. If they have plenty of natural food there is little incentive to chase down a WalMart special crankbait zipping by at warp speed. And the when and how are important too. When there are huge schools of available baitfish the predators save time and energy by going on a single feeding binge for a short time and stuffing their gut. Then they spend the next hours or days simply digesting and not hunting. They are sometimes susceptible to anglers if they are just coming off a digestive period...or if their last feeding foray was not a major success.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]So, it boils down to being in the right place at the right time with the right bait or lure. And that timing might be only for a few minutes at a time. After that you are just "washing lures". The exception...as you suggested...is when you use some kind of colorful or noisy lure that wakes them up and stimulates an involuntary "reaction bite". Kinda like teasing a cat with a string. You're the kitty expert so you should know.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]You've been around a few years and you have doubtless observed different peaks and valleys of fishing...for various species. There is one thing that few knowledgeable anglers will ever dispute: That is that fish feed when they are hungry. Another is that being in a school of feeding fish will cause them to hit almost anything just to keep the other fish from getting it first.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]Sadly, some of the most memorable fishing in Utah waters has often been during periods when low water and dwindling food supplies have forced the fish to become less cautious and more aggressive in their feeding. The flip side is that when water levels are up, the water is clear enough for sight feeding and there is plenty of natural food...well, it is just tougher for anglers to compete and score.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]Making shad a legal bait? That would work best if we could net them and use them live. Many other states allow use of live shad and I can testify that it can REALLY make a difference...as in the difference between a major harvest and zippo when they are really being selective. Not sure how well they would work in Willard but I am guessing they would get a few fishy votes. [/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]When I use carp or chub minnows in Willard it is not to try to substitute for shad. In case you hadn't noticed, there is a pretty good population of carp in Willard...and their young-of-the-year are a main menu item for all predators each year until they get too large to swallow. They do grow fast but before the shad get big enough to chase the baby carp are prime fodder for wipers, walleyes and catfish. [/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]Carp and chubs are both members of the minnow family and are both of the cyprinus genus. Their basic scent is similar so I doubt that opportunistic predators take the time to do a CSI or DNA test to see whether they should eat or not. Actually, there is no species in Willard that does not contribute young fry to the food chain. You will find the remnants of even small catfish in the innards of the occasional wiper or walleye. Ditto for smallies, perch, bluegill, etc. They all live on each other. One big happy family. Burp.[/#0000ff]
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[Kent]

[quote TubeDude]

[#0000ff]Actually, there is no species in Willard that does not contribute young fry to the food chain.

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Wipers would qualify, unless you count them being eaten after they are planted and before they grow too large.
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[TubeDude]

[cool][#0000ff]Yeah. Funny that wipers are both at the top and the bottom of the food chain. Wipers are typically planted as "sac fry"...newly hatched and still living off the yolk sac from the eggs. They are very tiny and as such are slurped up by the larger fry of all other species. And, since gizzard shad feed heavily on small invertebrates they also vacuum up lotsa bitty wipers. Kind of ironic that within a year the wipers will be turning the tables and dining on shad.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]As any of us who fish for white bass know, whities are notorius cannibals. They eat their own young and love pieces of cut white bass meat. That carries over into the wipers. They have no scruples about munching down any little transplants that are small enough to swallow. They never pause to check ID or family trees.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]I used to have scruples but I got vaccinated.[/#0000ff]
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[wiperhunter2]

With the weather not looking so good, this week might be tough but I'd be glad to get out there with you again next week or any afternoon, you can make it.
How did Mantua treat you?
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[wiperhunter2]

Thanks Pat. I did hear some stories, of some eye masters catching them by slowing down their presentation, I guess I'll try that on my next trip out. The baby shad in your pic is the exact size of the smaller shad I was seeing last week. I hope the big shad die off doesn't happen for a few more weeks, I need to get out there a few more times before that happens[].
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[TubeDude]

[cool][#0000ff]I know you remember the big drawdown when they were working on the dike. That happened about this time of year. I was down by the outlet, taking pics for future reference and met a GOB (good ol' boy) who was wading along the exposed mud shoreline. He had a couple of wipers and two or three nice walleye on a stringer in the water beside him. He was slinging out a 3" white tube jig and just dragging it slowly on the bottom. No action or swimming...just dragging. Claimed that was how he always fished Willard in the fall and that he always caught fish.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]Since then I have worked that into my routine, only I often use a 3" white or pearl Shad Grub from Barlows. And I have caught fish that way. [/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]When the water gets too cold for the wipers to chase warp speed cranks the walleyes seem to get more active...sometimes. I wish there was some kind of chart (or phone app) that would tell us exactly what to use and where to fish under any given set of conditions. But then that would take all the FUN out of being skunked and we would have to give up our memberships in Masochists Anonymous. Oh yeah, that's where masochists go to get drunk together.[/#0000ff]
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[toadly]

Hey Curt, Mantua is back to its old self. The water is much clearer and someone planted a bunch of 10 inch bows in it. Caught a few Bass and as always Trout. I may go next Sunday. Have to wait 'n see.[fishin]
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[wiperhunter2]

Funny you should mention that method because that it is the same thing I heard.
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