NOT designed for moving water ;)

[babdav]

TubeN2 and all,

i know that Ft's are not designed for moving water, but lets say that you wanted to take one on a gentle stream or slow river. Is the the Doughnut, U, or V style best for that?

anyone have any experience in one of these in SLOW moving water?
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[IrishFloatTube]

It isn't a good idea, and there are dangers which follow from using a tube in flowing water.
A guy drowned last year doing that quite close to some friends.

The problems are overhanging branches, branches under the water, lack of speed relative to the water's current speed, and part of the tube projects under the water. A more rock solid center of gravity is also desirable.

To minimise the design divantages of a tube in moving water you have to get the gear up out of the water, widen the sponson "footprint" and increase speed. A pontoon for example.

The conventional float tube that closest approximates these features is the one more suitable, or should I put it "least unsuitable". This means a Vee tube, of shallow draught - a high ride, of oversize dimensions, with no crossbar or crotch strap so easy exit is possible.

A H3 is nearest IMHO.

I have myself tubed and do tube in slow moving water of canal like non-turbulent character, and I'm happy to do that. Going upstream is possible in my vee tube (a Bullet) in these places, if I could not fin against the current with some to spare, I would not launch a tube in that location.

The recent thread [url "http://www.bigfishtackle.com/forum/Float_Tube_Fishing_C66/Float_Tubing_General_F81/Irish_Lough_Piking_-_Tubing_P414922/"][#212126]Irish Lough Piking - Tubing[/#212126][/url] shows myself and a friend launching into a small stream to get into a lake surrounded by reeds, which has no bank or boat access.
Have a look at the getting in photos and video clip (approx 9 - 10 posts down), notice the steeper sides that moving water cuts in the bank and the special difficulty it poses. So you have to have your entry and exit location pre-planned, unlike an open lakeshore the "average" spot is often unsuitable and you usually can't just "walk the tube out".

I hope this helps answer your question.
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[TubeDude]

[cool][#0000ff]You already know that tubes are not DESIGNED for flowing water. And, they are PROHIBITED on many waters by state laws. However, they ARE suitable for fishing on streams.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]That does not mean that you can safely and efficiently float every part of every creek and river. It does mean that there are stretches of many flows that can be fished from a tube without too much danger. I have tubed a lot of flowing water without ever getting into serious trouble. As Dirty Harry says "A man should know his limitations".[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]There are three main factors to consider in tubing flowing water...DEPTH, SPEED & HAZARDS. If you stay in water deep enough to avoid hitting rocks or getting "grounded", you can fish long stretches of river without too much concern for the other elements. [/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]The speed of the current is a factor only from the standpoint that it can move you faster than you want to go, if you are fishing along the way. You can use your fins to kick into eddies and slower flows...or even to get out on the shore and fish while wading. [/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]Hazards can be anything from fences across the water to tree branches (sweepers) to sunken trees and rocks that will grab you and sink you...or damage you and/or your craft. Sitting with more of your body in the water...in a donut...will expose you to more of that stuff.[/#0000ff]

[#0000ff]Possibly one of the worst potential hazards are shallow gravel bars with significant current running over them. You can find yourself stuck on one of these with no way to break the hold of the current. And, if you try to stand, the current can topple you and roll you down the river. Not good. Stay away from the shallows if there is current.[/#0000ff]

[#0000ff]The best places to get in and out are in eddies or backwaters, out of the current. And, whenever fishing or fighting fish, you can also maneuver into slower waters to save energy in kicking.[/#0000ff]

[#0000ff]If you are determined to float a creek or river, there are some precautions. First, float it first in a stable boat or pontoon, to learn the potential hazards and to target the areas you want to stop and fish. NEVER float a flow with which you are not already very familiar. And, if there are too many potential hazards, find another place to float.[/#0000ff]

[#0000ff]Second, always have at least one other person with you...preferably in a boat or pontoon...JUST IN CASE. [/#0000ff]

[#0000ff]Third, if making a long downstream float, be sure to leave a vehicle where you plan to get out...or arrange for pickup at a designated time and place.[/#0000ff]

[#0000ff]All that being said, much of the fishing I have done in moving water has been in only one place on larger rivers. If it is both safe and legal, you can fish the calm "spillway" areas below some dams. Often they only have one or two gates open, with large calm areas in front of the others. But, be sure you know the schedule so that you do not get caught when they unexpectedly open other gates.[/#0000ff]

[#0000ff]There are also oxbows and backwaters on some rivers that are just like fishing lakes. You may have to access them from upstream, by launching into the river and floating down to them.[/#0000ff]

[#0000ff]I have fished short stretches of large creeks and rivers where the depth and flow were such that I could launch and maintain position within the area I wished to fish...and then maneuver my way back to my original launch site...or to one conveniently close. In other words, fishing a flow does not mean making a white water trip down a raging river.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]As far as choice of craft, it is a matter of physics. The more of you there is in the water, the more you will be affected by the current. The higher you sit on the water, the more efficient your kicking strokes will be in moving you against the current or propelling you to where you want to go. In other words, a high riding craft with a pointed "bow" is more efficient than a round tube with half your body in the water.[/#0000ff]

[#0000ff]Be smart and be safe.[/#0000ff]
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[Majja]

If I were going to do it it would be in my h3 only. If you go to there website they show them running some class 2 rapids I think. But personally i would rather be in a pontoon cause you can get your feet up and steer and paddle with the oars. Now before Joni chimes in I will say you can also do this on the nav II. So I guess my vote is for the V

Majja
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[babdav]

Norm, TD, MAjja-

thanks for all the excellent detailed responses. After absorbing all your info I went to the local cabelas and got a first hand look at the tubes. Forums and eyeball indicate that odc and fishcat 4 are similar shape and dimensions- I am concerned with snags and drags.

Obviously a pontoon boat would be a better option for flowing water but I gotta keep it small simple and cheap.

Now the odc 420 ahas a 30 oz pvc bottom and the fc4 has a 600 denier pvc bottom.

Is this comparison apples to oranges? Which one is tougher??
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[TubeDude]

[cool][#0000ff]I have no idea what a "conversion table" for denier vs ounces might be. But, I like both apples and oranges.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]The one observation I might make is that as a newbie you are maybe reading too much into the situation. There SHOULD BE very few times in which the bottom of your craft drags on rocks or snags. That is called basic navigation. About the only time you will have any concern will be while launching or beaching, over rough bottom conditions. And even then, you will likely not be adding weight by sitting down until you are deep enough to avoid serious scraping.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]The other factor that can enter into it is dragging your craft across parking lots or rocks when launching or beaching. Don't do it. Pick it up or move it on a cart or something if you have a ways to go to get to the water. Also, when you set your craft down on the ground...parking lot or lake shore...do it gently. Dropping it from altitude might get a puncture from an unseen piece of glass or sticker, whereas a gentle approach could prevent it.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]The PVC is there to help us help ourselves. If we should accidentally encounter potentially damaging stuff under our craft, the PVC will help prevent minor leaks. But, if you insist on using your tube as an all terrain vehicle, it will not hold up long. For example, I know of one fairly new FC4 that was quickly destroyed by a member's teenage son using it for tobogganing down a ski slope. [/#0000ff]
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[babdav]

NORM,
those are some beautiful pike- what size are the ones you are catching there? Nice pics of your stream launching!

TD,
i like oranges and apples too! But like you, i can only grow apples here, and thats primarily what I know about.
Im asking about snags because a friend of mine has got me excited about fishing some spots on the jordan- and I think if I am prepared, i can float, walk, anchor etc down to a few good spots. (we'll be moving into a home that is a stones throw- i mean a jigs-cast away from the banks).

I dont mean to annoy anybody by splitting hairs over micron widths of tube stitching []. 'Just wanna get a good tube! I need to stop typing and start fishing already!
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[IrishFloatTube]

[#0000ff]TD: .... I know of one fairly new FC4 that was quickly destroyed by a member's teenage son using it for tobogganing down a ski slope....[/#0000ff]
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[#000000]I'd say there was a wonderful father-son conversation after that little episode !
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[#0000ff]Babdav: ... Forums and eyeball indicate that odc and fishcat 4 are similar shape and dimensions- I am concerned with snags and drags. ... [/#0000ff]
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[#000000]Hi Babdav - they are not quite the same size. The ODC is a little bigger than the FC4 but smaller than the Fat Cat and SFC. (if it makes a difference)

The Fat Cat and SFC are bigger so they might just be attractive for the slow moving water since they approximate closer to the ideal of high ride and size required. Esp if a H3 is out price-wise.

The thing is - all of the tubes you're looking at are good tubes. So don't worry about quality because you are already "over the vital threshhold" quality-wise.
Look to comfort and design that suits you personal mode of use. SIze of tackle boxes vs size of pockets.[/#000000]
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[#0000bf]... those are some beautiful pike- what size are the ones you are catching there? ...
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In Ireland I'm in perfect lattitude for cold water species. Having a mild climate we have no freeze-up in winter , so they achieve growth for a much longer period of each year than eg Canada, US, or mainland Europe which have more extreme temp variations.
Trout and pike grow fast here.
A decent day piking over here would see maybe 3 - 10 fish caught with 1-2 in the teens, and a twenty popping up say after several good trips.
But it's been tough lately ... gale force winds and cold east winds from Europe instead of the usual milder Atlantic westerly sea breezes we expect, so all the fishing here seems to be almost a month late seasonally speaking.
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[babdav]

norm,

Any tiger muskies in your waters?

my dad and brother have done several successful trips to canada for big northern pike and tigers.
After this, my brother is wild for the muskellunge in a local fishing spot called pineview.
I have never caught pike- pound for pound, what does the fight compare with?

-dave
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[IrishFloatTube]

It's all northern pike here ... no muskies on the eastern seaboard of the Atlantic.
So I can't compare the two
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[TubeDude]

[cool][#0000ff]Pike and muskies can be caught from a tube very well. But, you should never attempt it unless you are both an experienced tuber and you know how to control and handle big toothy fish. [/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]The thrill of catching these large toothy predators is not so much how they fight. They are big and they pull hard...and sometimes jump...but mostly they do not fight as hard as a carp of similar size. Large ones will take line out against your drag, but they mostly just swim around a bit and then come to the boat or tube. However, when they feel a net around them they sometimes go wacko...thrashing and rolling. Not good to net them if you don't have to because they tear up their fins and remove mucus from their skins...if you plan to release them. If you don't, then you have to worry about keeping them in a basket or something that will keep them from biting you or your tube before you get them ashore.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]The big thrill of catching pike and muskies is first in finding them and getting them to strike. They can be hard to find and even harder to get to hit a lure. But, the vicious strike is what makes them so memorable. If you are lucky enough to see the strike it is scary. Pure savage predatory munching.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]After that it is just pulling in a large fish.[/#0000ff]
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[babdav]

TD,
have you caught the fresh water sharks from a tube?
pineview?
Ever fished the jordan in a tube? (dont know why you would need to, the banks seem accessible and the river is rather narrow for casting off either side- just curious)
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[TubeDude]

[cool][#0000ff]I have taken quite a few northern pike from my tube, but always by accident, while fishing for something else.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]I do not fish Pineview from my tube. Too many other places to fish that are quieter and safer.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]I have taken SALT WATER sharks from my tube too. No great whites though. Mostly smaller inshore species.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]And, yes, I have tubed the Jordan, but only near the mouth. There are a couple of places you can launch upstream from the pumphouse and really do well. Here is a picture of a group of walleye I took from that spot back in the days before the silly size restriction limits.[/#0000ff]
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