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Hi folks again,
Well it was a complete success! I took my fishing bud there with our dogs and flost tubes and he caught a 20 in. LM!!!!!!!! The biggest he's ever caught!!! We caught bass, blue gill and a big perch. He's going to have a big back yard cook tomorrow!
[  ][crazy][ ]Leaky
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you didnt keep the bass did you??
joe
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Jpe,
You're joking right?
[unsure]Leaky
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Sorry man, I never keep my bass. they take long to grow, so let them go! thats my motto. well.... thats just my opinion. I release all bass.
joe
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[cool]Hey, Leaky. Glad you guys had a good trip. Hope Bud doesn't develop that "itchy twitchy" reaction to the swimmers' itch. I'm guessing the weeds are probably getting pretty thick in there by now. At least Mantua treated you a lot better than some of your trips late last year. Always good to be able to show a newbie a good time...and to have them catch a biggun or two.
NOTE: Let's not make this forum a platform to argue the merits of catch and release vs hook and cook. These are issues that every angler must decide for themselves, for their own reasons. There are some waters in which the bass populations are self-sustaining...or even suffering from an overbalance of predators (bass) and a light harvest is beneficial to keep the bass from stunting.
Joe, you are not familiar with the little lake (Mantua) where Leaky fished, but it is one of those waters in which there are lots of "bitty bass" and very few large ones. People are encouraged to harvest the smaller fish and release the big ones, which Leaky always does. In fact, he seldom keeps trout or bass for the table...preferring whitefish, perch and other sunfish. If his guest elected to keep a couple of bass, that is a matter of personal choice and can be excused.
The problem on most waters is not the occasional harvest, but the people who load up and keep everything they catch. The fish and game department refers to this as "subsistence fishing". Some of our ethnic groups (and plain fishing slobs) feel that the fish are put in our waters for their exclusive harvest. They are not sportsmen, and often become hostile when confronted. They fish for food...either because they traditionally have a lot of fish in their diets, and/or because they do not have money in their budgets to buy it at the market.
All I can say is that I am glad that I do not have to keep all the fish I catch to feed my family. It is great that we are able to have a choice as to whether we keep an occasional fish...or to release it after enjoying the sport. We do not have to agree with the outlooks and oractices of others, but there is no need to slam someone simply because they do not have the same outlooks we do.
NUFF SAID.
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wow! I didn't think of it that way. I have been not thinking very well in the past either. but that is no excuse. I am sorry leaky. I didnt know the circumstances of the lake. In the lake by my house, the bass population is scarce. well, atleast the big ones are scares. we have hundreds of little 4 inchers. haha.
well, sorry leaky and tube dude for the things that I said. I wasn't thinking.
joe
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[cool]I don't think you offended anyone, Joe. Us old farts have thick skin. I did not think Leaky would say much on his own behalf, so I thought I would explain it a little.
What I failed to do is congratulate YOU on a great attitude. You are a fine young sportsman. In areas like you live in, there is far too much harvest and too little releasing. The same people who keep all the fish are the ones who complain when the hatchery trucks don't dump enough fish for them. We can only feel sorry for them. They are missing out on the real enjoyment of fishing.
I have made no secret of the fact that I keep a lot of fish. But, I usually go after species that are in great numbers and are not overly abused by the masses. I would rather eat yellow bass, sunfish and catfish than largemouth or trout anyway...especially those white fleshed trout freshly dumped from the hatchery. Those are truly "garbage fish", but they are great for helping kids catch something and learning to enjoy fishing.
Also, none of the fish I bring home are wasted. I fillet them and chill them quickly and what I cannot consume goes to a son and his family...all of who like fish. Because of a health problem, my oldest son is mostly unable to go fishing like he once did.
Again, thanks for your contribution, Joe. Don't worry about anyone being mad at you. I know Leaky is not. And, I am still planning to send over those jig heads next week, so I ain't mad at ya either.
Keep on keepin' on.
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haha ok. thats good to know ]
they dont plant bass in the lake that I was talking about. so there needs to be more people who release them. but oh well. chris and I were thinking about posting signs saying "please release the bass, the population is low!" but never have. oh well.
joe
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joe,
Absolutely no hard feelings taken. I took it in the vein that it was intended!!!!!!!!! Have many, many good fishing days in the future and keep up the good ethics.
P.S. Pat - Wow, thanks man, I only hope I can live up to the image you painted of me. I've got something to shot for!!!!!
[cool]Leaky
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Hey Leaky! We need to get you a digital camera. I've enjoyed your posts on this board as well as the Utah board, but I've been dying to see some pictures!
Maybe there is one that Bud could use . . . maybe mount it on his head [ ]???
Sounds like a great trip, I'm jealous.
See you on the water,
ES
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Emu,
Actually my partner did take some pictures with his camera when we got back. When he sends me some, maybe I'll post up. Bud was too busy swimming to help much. It's kind of hard to take a picture of your stuff in a float tube without help. Thanks for the complement!
[ ]Leaky
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I hear you. The most I can usually get in a pic is my hand holding the fish. The only problem is that there is no evidence that it is my hand[crazy]. I'll look forward to the pics when you get them.
I'll be out in my pontoon boat tomorrow morning around the Provo boat harbor on Utah Lake. I'll try to post a report hopefully with some pics of a disebodied hand holding fish.
See you on the water!
ES
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[cool]You are a fisherman. Fishermen do not take untruthful pictures. If you tell us that it is your hand in the picture, we will believe you.
One of the things I have been considering, in order to take a picture of an especially fine specimen, before releasing, is to cradle the fish on both fins, once it is subdued. With a little luck, the fish will hold still long enough to snap a pic. There are some fish that are especially well marked, or have unusual physical characteristics we would like to remember in photo form.
I know that there have been a lot of "photo ops" over the years that I have missed simply because I either did not have a camera or did not have someone to take a pic with me in it. Now that I have a small digital that fits in a pocket safely and out of the way, I no longer have any excuse for missing those special shots. But, I still forget, while my heart is still fluttering from a good battle with a fine fish. As I watch them headed back down to their living room I think "Why didn't I get a shot of that?"
One of these days, when I find my way back north, we will have to get a flotation flotilla going, and have everyone fixed up with cameras. Then, if we can get the fish to cooperate we can start a BFT album. Think you can have Bud trained to shoot digital pics by then, Leaky?
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Dude,
If that floatilla was to happen, my inclination would be to have Bud "help" you guys while I kick back, giggle a lot, and take the pictures myself. Did either of you guys read about the huge rattler I ran across at Mantua? Be careful out there, especially with a dog!!!!!!!!!
Leaky
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I missed the rattler part, that would put a couple of holes in the waders. Worse yet, it could put a couple of holes in a Bud[  ]. Thanks for the heads up Leaky. When I lived in Logan, the rattlers were always a concern when fishing by the rocks in the canyon.
TD, let us know when you heading up this way, we could have our own 'power squadron!' Granted we wouldn't create much of a wake, or buzz people very quickly, but if the water keeps dropping, we won't have to worry about anyone else anyway.
See you on the water!
ES
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[cool]Hey, Leaky, I'm glad that Bud is "snakeproof" and that he is your ears when it comes to rattlers. When most people start to suffer hearing loss, it is usually in the lower ranges, where the sound of a rattler falls. I have a similar problem, but I can still hear them.
I have seen rattlesnakes all over the country...from my boyhood fishing areas in Idaho to Florida. I have probably seen over twenty different species...including the ones that do not even have rattles, on a couple of islands in the Gulf of California (Sea of Cortez). I have seen the reddish Pacific diamondback in California, and some in the high country of Arizona that are almost all black. The nastiest are the Mohave rattlers, of southern California and into Arizona. They are mean and aggressive, and they have a double action poison...both neurotoxin and hemotoxin. That both shuts down your breathing and heatbeat and digests your tissue from the inside.
The snakes in Utah seldom get over three to four feet. In some areas they are timber rattlers, and in other areas they are prairie rattlers. The big western diamondbacks we have down in Arizona get up to almost 6 feet. But, the champs are the eastern diamondbacks in Florida. They have been reliably measured at 8 feet, and as big around as a man's thigh. They eat whole cottontails and have fangs an inch long. Definitely not something you would want to interfere with a fishing trip.
Just be thankful you don't have water moccassins up there. They do not rattle and they are some of the most aggressive of the poisonous snakes in the country. They will move toward you, striking as they come, once they sense you. Almost every rattler I have ever encountered has either held it's ground, or tried to slither away.
I used to hike the tracks along Deer Creek Reservoir a lot. I saw a lot of rattlers there...especially in the evenings on warm days. I also found a few along the tracks on the Provo River, below Deer Creek.
It pays to stay alert and always watch where you are going. Look first under any bushes you might pass close by, and even up into the bushes. Snakes sometimes crawl up off the ground to escape the heat or watch for prey.
A "city clicker" joke down here is about a guy staying on a dude ranch (no relation), who came into dinner one evening, shaking a set of rattlesnake rattles. One of the other city folks asked him where he got them. His reply was "Off a big woim." (that's WORM to youse guys dat don't speak New Yawk)
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Dude,
This guy was big. I don't know if I can distinquish between a diamond back and a timber rattler and can't dispute your comment about no diamond backs in Utah but from observation and the diameter of his body, he was no 3-4ft guy. I would guess in the 5ft plus? range. He was coiled and ready for action so I might have been fooled. His buttons looked to be about 1 1/2 in. length and about 6-8 buttons. He was honkered down in the brush at the side of the road. I wanted to investigate futher and possibly catch him for a closer look but my partner was freaked out so I decided to leave it alone. When I was a kid one of the many things I used to catch for short time observation and even many times for long term captivity were snakes including a few rattlers. I just find wild life in all forms interesting. Have captured skunks, bull snakes, pink racers, blue heron, jack rabbits, ducks, squirrels, magpies, turtles etc., etc.. Needless to say my Chicago born wife put a stop to that right away. I guess that's why when I run across a trapped animal, I have to release it. Trappers, ranchers and most sportsmen would not be happy with me.
Leaky
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[cool]My wife is no great lover of reptiles either. In the early years of our marriage, whenever I heard her hit "High C", I did not ask what it was...I asked where it was. I knew it would be a snake. And it did not matter what kind it was. A snake was a snake.
Over the years we have done a lot of hiking and exploring, and she has seen enough snakes that she has a passive interest in them. She will at least stay nearby while I take a picture of it. But, I do not think whe will ever go along with holding even a harmless little garter snake.
And, about "guestimating" length, we have a running joke that "snake feet" are always at least double normal measurement. In other words, if I tell someone we saw a three foot rattler, she corrects me with "It was SIX feet."
I do not dispute your estimate of size or species. It could have been a diamondback and it could have been a five footer. I am not sure as to the limits on their ranges.
I'm glad you did not try to handle it. A statistic offered the by Arizona wildlife department is that over 70% of all snakebites occur from people trying to handle snakes. Even if you know what you are doing, they are good at watching for an opening and ZAP. I watched them transport a dumb fisherman away from Patagonia Lake, in southern Arizona a few years ago, who was trying to show off for his beer drinking buddies. He picked up a rattler, and when it bit him, he dropped it and tried to stomp it to death. He got bit about six times on his bare legs and feet.
I tell everyone I am not affected by snakebite. I say that I got bit once, and in spite of everything we could do, the snake died.
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Dude,
You're right about the advisablity of my handling that guy, if for no other reason than my reflexs are probably 30% of what they were then!!!!!! But, if my partner wasn't there I would have done it. Good thing he was there. We're going there tomorrow and I'll be looking out for him.
Leaky
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Hey,
Play nice! Lay off the New Yorker Jokes it's not our fault we ain't accustomed to seeing worms with pretty buttons on thier tails[  ]
Al
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