Quagga solution?

[TubeDude]

[#0000FF]This last storm is not going to solve the drought problem. But maybe the drought problem can help solve the quagga problem.

Here's a Bagley cartoon in the SL Tribune today. (Click on the image to enlarge)

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[PIKEMAN99]

I love it you smart a$$
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[Pharticus]

Behind every cloud...
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[Therapist]

Drain and Dry !!!!

[TubeDude]

[quote Therapist]Drain and Dry !!!![/quote]

[#0000FF]And...laugh before you cry.[/#0000FF]
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[FishMcFisherson]

Not to stray from the hilariousness, but that storm has got to make some solid difference, right?

I heard Snowbird got over 40" of snow.

What's the score here?
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[brookieguy1]

[quote FishMcFisherson]Not to stray from the hilariousness, but that storm has got to make some solid difference, right?

I heard Snowbird got over 40" of snow.

What's the score here?[/quote]According to the "experts"... we need about one a week like that for the next two months. I say horse sh@#$. A couple more of those wet SOBs should keep us good 'till September.
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[utahgolf]

how do those red ears do? I also saw a thing on lake havasu, where the mussels actually helped by attaching to all those structures they built for the fish and made the fish more comfortable in using them. They said it improved the fishing. I know different areas but thought it was interesting.
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[Therapist]

The small benefit derived from having the mussels attach to artificial structures is far outweighed by the damage they do. Go on line and read about the cost to remove them from water intakes, clogging pumps, filters, and the like. Another MAJOR problem is the waste products produced from large populations of mussels. They will form a noxious blanket over an area, removing the oxygen and killing everything in the area. THEN, as the dead mussels decompose, they STINK. The empty shells also foul the beach/shoreline. They are razor sharp and you cannot walk on them barefoot.

There is nothing positive about Quagga/Zebra Mussels. They are a total disaster!! Don't wish them on anyone !!

Regarding Red Ears, there is a good chance that they will be introduced at Powell. Have not heard the final result on that yet, but that was one of the suggestions of the panel looking at the management plan for Powell.

Lots to come yet on this issue !! Check out the other thread on Mussels in Deer Creek started by Rancid Crabtree !!

[a_bow_nut]

[quote FishMcFisherson]Not to stray from the hilariousness, but that storm has got to make some solid difference, right?

I heard Snowbird got over 40" of snow.

What's the score here?[/quote]

Sadly none of that snow made it up over the mountain. Through the whole storm there was only an inch or two on the ground in the Park City and Heber areas and it was gone the next day. Even the mountains on this side of the front don't show many signs of new snow.
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[TubeDude]

[#0000FF]Because redears have done well in Havasu people get the impression that they are eating all the quaggas and getting fat. True, they do dine on quaggas but that is not their exclusive diet. They also eat small crawdads and other invertebrates. So they are not a surefire guaranteed solution to the mussel problem.

And, has already been mentioned, the very few things that might benefit from an infestation of quaggas are miniscule in comparison to the outright harm they cause.

Still, anything that could be done (like planting redears) to slow down or reduce the infestation is a step in the right direction. Plus...they are a great species on the rod. Used to fish for them down south and in Arizona. Hit hard, fight hard and great to eat.
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[FishingLunatic]

I go to the U and am taking a Resource Conservation and Mangement class and last week we had a guest speaker involved in water rights come visit us. She actually talked about how they want to make it so that no boats whatsoever are allowed at places like Deer creek. Places like Deer creek are primarily meant for water use, NOT recreation use. With a growing human population, we're somehow going to have to get more water in addition to maintaining our current water resources. Quagga mussels clog dams. I wouldn't be shocked if if the near future Deer creek and places like that can't have boats at all.
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[Therapist]

That is some dumb SOB bureaucrat spouting bovine scatology. All these reservoirs were built with dual purpose in mind, water storage and recreation. The water storage was primarily agriculture, not municipal/culinary. I am sure that the powers that be would love to ban recreation, but it ain't going to happen any time soon.

[dtayboyz]

The water comes out of the faucet silly and food comes from the store. Everybody knows that. Thank goodness I live on the snake river plain.
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[bassrods]

Until the 70's Deer Creek was used for fishing, you could not water skiing at all..
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[FishingLunatic]

I hope you're right but I don't know. As we've all figured out from our existence in Utah, Utah is a DESERT state..most of our "rivers" would be classified as creeks anywhere else. That said, the Provo River is one of our major sources of water, if any of the reservoirs filled with Provo River water are contaminated then the whole Provo river is contaminated and seeing as it a major source of our water, if they deem it to be threatened i'm pretty sure they could do stuff like take away our boat uses on lakes like that really fast.
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[TubeDude]

[#0000FF]I never sneeze to be demazed at some of the contrarian positions developed by people who claim to be "experts".

I think some of these people lay awake at nights trying to think of something they can say to get a reaction from the public.

NUKE THE GAY WHALES
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[PBH]

[quote FishingLunatic]She actually talked about how they want to make it so that no boats whatsoever are allowed at places like Deer creek.[/quote]

[quote Therapist]That is some dumb SOB bureaucrat spouting bovine scatology. All these reservoirs were built with dual purpose in mind, water storage and recreation. The water storage was primarily agriculture, not municipal/culinary. I am sure that the powers that be would love to ban recreation, but it ain't going to happen any time soon.[/quote]

No it isn't dumb SOB bureaucratic spouting. It is a legitimate concern. Maybe not at Deer Creek -- but what about Yuba? Otter Creek? Tropic Reservoir? When IPP, and the other water owners decide that the risk to their water is too great, they certainly could work towards banning boats. What about a place like Enterprise Reservoir or Newcastle Reservoir? They are agriculture users -- mussels pose a huge concern to those guys too. When those alfalfa growers turn on their sprinklers, only to find that mussel shells are the only things coming out (no water, just shells) -- will they try to ban boats from their impoundments? You bet. They can't afford the maintenance to keep their pipes clean, not to mention their pumps, sprinklers, etc.

Washington County has already discussed some of this. They plan to build a new reservoir near Laverkin -- and are already planning for it to be a "boatless" lake -- and not just motor boats, but float tubes too! When Sand Hollow turned up an adult mussle, the first thing Ron Thompson wanted to do was shut the lake down to boats. It certainly is a threat to recreation.


Water owners do NOT want mussels. They are extremely costly -- and if it's boats that is bringing these critters, then it is certainly not out of the question for those water owners to prevent boats from accessing those resources.
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[Therapist]

Water Managers do have a different approach as they are responsible for the delivery of water to the users. However, if a body of water was built with public funds, with dual purpose as part of the reason to spend the money, then the public needs to be able to use the recreation portion of the water.

Yuba could be come no boat due to the fact that IPP owns the water, but do they own the basin ?? I don't know how that works.

I wish my grandfather was still alive, he was an expert in water law and could answer many of these questions.

The bottom line is that if we want to continue to have access to public and private waters, we are all going to have to be very diligent to make sure that these little critters do not get introduced anywhere else.

[dubob]

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[font "Comic Sans MS"][#800000]Generally speaking, most of the reservoirs of any size in Utah were built by some Federal government agency; Bureau of Reclamation, Bureau of Land Management, US Forest Service, etc. Those agencies actually ‘own’ those reservoirs. And in almost every case, the reservoirs were built to supply water to some user; agricultural users for growing things and residential users for drinking and household stuff. These uses are controlled by some local, state level agency under contract to the ‘owner.’ Where appropriate, recreational use, such as boating, swimming, and fishing, is planned for and managed by another state agency like the Park Service.[/#800000][/font]
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[font "Comic Sans MS"][#800000]However, I know of no Utah reservoir that puts recreational use as the number one purpose ahead of the agricultural/residential use of the stored water. The agricultural/residential use will always be the prime consideration for management of the water and recreation will always be secondary to that use. They are never on an equal footing to my knowledge.[/#800000][/font]
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[font "Comic Sans MS"][#800000]If any recreational use ever negatively impacts agricultural/residential use of a reservoir’s water, then the recreational use will be curtailed or eliminated. An example of this is the total ban on OHV use on the ice of some reservoirs during ice fishing season. It is not being aggressively enforced, but there are some reservoirs that legally don’t allow OHV use on the ice.[/#800000][/font]
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[font "Comic Sans MS"][#800000]I’m hopeful that science will ultimately give us a solution to the mussel problem we are now facing in Utah, because the current Utah honor system of declaring watercraft cleaned by owners is a joke. The only way you can come anywhere close to making a successful program would be to require mandatory cleaning of EVERY watercraft prior to entering EVERY body of water in Utah. Anybody ever see that happening?[/#800000][/font]
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[font "Comic Sans MS"][#800000]The mussel threat is real. They are going to eventually show up in every Utah water body; it’s just a matter of time. Utah’s stupid honor system of declared boat cleaning will NOT prevent it from happening. And I will not be surprised when water management agencies finally decide that the financial risk to their end users is too great for them to continue to allow recreational use of the water source. Anybody who thinks that is not a possibility is not fully in touch with reality.[/#800000][/font]
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