10-07-2007, 09:14 PM
[cool][#0000ff][size 1]You said [/size][black][size 3]"[/size][/black][/#0000ff][black][size 3]Less slime removal from the rubber netting versus nylon or cotton."
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[#0000ff][#0000ff][size 1]Not attacking you, but I find it interesting (not funny) that comment comes from someone who always poses clients holding big fish against their dry clothing. I'm sure that does not do much for the slime coating of those fish either.[/size][/#0000ff][/#0000ff]
[#0000ff][size 1][/size][/#0000ff]
[black]Tubedude: I couldn't agree more. Holding fish against dry clothing for photos does remove protective slime. But even worse, and I see it on many many fish, is the slime that is removed from fish in my own and others' nets. I don't have (and can't seem to find) a large enough rubber net to hold a 30 pound laker, much less a couple of them when we double-up. We catch fish regularly that have "net marks' on them from past nettings, so they're living, but the marks are clearly visible.[/black]
Having said that, I've seen no evidence and have no reason to believe today, that our fish handling of the large macks at the Gorge, is having a measurable effect on our mortality rate. At least not the way I assist and instruct everyone in my boat to do it. Those big lakers have a lot of slime, and although much of one side of the fish often touches clothing, I don't believe it's increasing mortality. I'm sure I lose more to line cuts during the fight. And again, I see more slime come off the fish when its moving in my nylon net than I do when I lift a fish into the arms of a customer. I do believe the net does the most "damage."
If I had my way, not one of my customers would ever hold one fish out of the water for a photo. In that case, we'd never net a fish either. My dream is to someday guide on the Gorge and not even have a net on my boat. No net, no fish removal from the water. Just get 'em up, take a look, maybe a quick snap-shot in the water, pop the hook out, and send them on their way. And at the same time, throw the scale overboard too. I lift my net, with the fish in it, to weigh the fish. Everybody wants to know, "What does that one weigh? Is it over 30?!!" Honestly, I don't care these days, but the paying customer does, so I weight most of them in the net.
Last year I began releasing tarpon in Florida without handling. We now don't remove them from the water. Just bring 'em up, get a couple of stern-side photos, remove the hook, and give them a little push away. No scale, no tape, no fish-out-of-water photo. My customers that fish with me in Florida, however, are, lets just say, "more advanced." They don't need a picture to make their trip complete. And this summer, that became law in Florida. "Harvest" means to remove from the water. I can't wait for that same attitude on the Gorge someday. I don't like extra laws, but it's a good one in my opinion. Many Florida guides have been doing this for a decade or more, and I finally learned it was "OK" from them! (Some even on the Florida BFT Forum!!!)
Unfortunately, this is not likely in this part of the country in the foreseeable future. Most of my customers would not even go mack fishing, even if it were free, if they couldn't go home with a picture of themselves holding "the big one" that they caught. Admittedly, they do make for good memories, but I hear all kinds of crap like "I need it to show my wife so she knows I was really fishing," and "I gotta show my buddy or he/she won't believe me." To that, I say "who cares if anyone believes you or not?" I hope that's not why most people fish, to impress their friends.
All but a few customers insist on pictures though, and I have bills to pay, so we click away. Some just photograph a fish here and there, but those are mostly folks who already have an album full! I post them on my website because the fish are out of the water anyway. Might as well if the fish is already out. I did guide successfully for 20 years without a website with pictures pasted all over it, so its not necessary for me to market my services. Its just to make the customer happy, and that needs to change, even if it's having little effect on mortality. And I created my own monster with that "recent catches" page on my site. I have customers every month say, "I just want to be on your website!" I should be setting the example, and am seriously considering making that page go away.
If anyone knows where I can find a deep, 36" rubber net, the Mastercard is ready!!! That would be the next step for me. BLM graciously bought me a $150 square-bottom Beckman earlier this year that is the best I've used so far, but its still nylon and scratchy. (I do love that net BLM!)
Hopefully there will come a time when anglers don't need a photo of themselves holding their "trophy" catch to be fulfilled or feel a sense of accomplishment. Until then, we can all do the best we can, and continue to refine our fish handling techniques with the fish's best interest in mind.
I've been thinking about this more and more with each passing season. I've considered offering a discount to anglers who agree to never remove a fish from the water. I have no idea how that would be received. I've also considered building some kind of rectangular "net" or "box" or cradle in which the fish could be transferred to, in the water, for a scale photo. It would have a tape measure clearly visible. Perhaps the time has come.
Now I know I'm opening myself up here, but how about taking a giant step and saying, lets all just stop taking pictures of large fish that are going to be released? Not all fish, just those that need our protection. This won't fly with many, if not most, but it has to start somewhere. Remember when "catch and release" sounded like the dumbest idea on the planet? There was a time, when I was very young. Maybe its time for another dumb idea (limit photos) to start taking baby steps toward reality.
This ended up long, but I think its one of the most important issues facing fishermen now and in the future. There are more of us fishing the waters, with more knowledge and technology, and we're not gaining any more water or fish to my knowledge. And, its something we, as fishermen, CAN do something about without the need for crooked politicians or ignorant fish managers. It's in OUR hands! (and so are the gills and the slime!)
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[/size][/black]
[#0000ff][#0000ff][size 1]Not attacking you, but I find it interesting (not funny) that comment comes from someone who always poses clients holding big fish against their dry clothing. I'm sure that does not do much for the slime coating of those fish either.[/size][/#0000ff][/#0000ff]
[#0000ff][size 1][/size][/#0000ff]
[black]Tubedude: I couldn't agree more. Holding fish against dry clothing for photos does remove protective slime. But even worse, and I see it on many many fish, is the slime that is removed from fish in my own and others' nets. I don't have (and can't seem to find) a large enough rubber net to hold a 30 pound laker, much less a couple of them when we double-up. We catch fish regularly that have "net marks' on them from past nettings, so they're living, but the marks are clearly visible.[/black]
Having said that, I've seen no evidence and have no reason to believe today, that our fish handling of the large macks at the Gorge, is having a measurable effect on our mortality rate. At least not the way I assist and instruct everyone in my boat to do it. Those big lakers have a lot of slime, and although much of one side of the fish often touches clothing, I don't believe it's increasing mortality. I'm sure I lose more to line cuts during the fight. And again, I see more slime come off the fish when its moving in my nylon net than I do when I lift a fish into the arms of a customer. I do believe the net does the most "damage."
If I had my way, not one of my customers would ever hold one fish out of the water for a photo. In that case, we'd never net a fish either. My dream is to someday guide on the Gorge and not even have a net on my boat. No net, no fish removal from the water. Just get 'em up, take a look, maybe a quick snap-shot in the water, pop the hook out, and send them on their way. And at the same time, throw the scale overboard too. I lift my net, with the fish in it, to weigh the fish. Everybody wants to know, "What does that one weigh? Is it over 30?!!" Honestly, I don't care these days, but the paying customer does, so I weight most of them in the net.
Last year I began releasing tarpon in Florida without handling. We now don't remove them from the water. Just bring 'em up, get a couple of stern-side photos, remove the hook, and give them a little push away. No scale, no tape, no fish-out-of-water photo. My customers that fish with me in Florida, however, are, lets just say, "more advanced." They don't need a picture to make their trip complete. And this summer, that became law in Florida. "Harvest" means to remove from the water. I can't wait for that same attitude on the Gorge someday. I don't like extra laws, but it's a good one in my opinion. Many Florida guides have been doing this for a decade or more, and I finally learned it was "OK" from them! (Some even on the Florida BFT Forum!!!)
Unfortunately, this is not likely in this part of the country in the foreseeable future. Most of my customers would not even go mack fishing, even if it were free, if they couldn't go home with a picture of themselves holding "the big one" that they caught. Admittedly, they do make for good memories, but I hear all kinds of crap like "I need it to show my wife so she knows I was really fishing," and "I gotta show my buddy or he/she won't believe me." To that, I say "who cares if anyone believes you or not?" I hope that's not why most people fish, to impress their friends.
All but a few customers insist on pictures though, and I have bills to pay, so we click away. Some just photograph a fish here and there, but those are mostly folks who already have an album full! I post them on my website because the fish are out of the water anyway. Might as well if the fish is already out. I did guide successfully for 20 years without a website with pictures pasted all over it, so its not necessary for me to market my services. Its just to make the customer happy, and that needs to change, even if it's having little effect on mortality. And I created my own monster with that "recent catches" page on my site. I have customers every month say, "I just want to be on your website!" I should be setting the example, and am seriously considering making that page go away.
If anyone knows where I can find a deep, 36" rubber net, the Mastercard is ready!!! That would be the next step for me. BLM graciously bought me a $150 square-bottom Beckman earlier this year that is the best I've used so far, but its still nylon and scratchy. (I do love that net BLM!)
Hopefully there will come a time when anglers don't need a photo of themselves holding their "trophy" catch to be fulfilled or feel a sense of accomplishment. Until then, we can all do the best we can, and continue to refine our fish handling techniques with the fish's best interest in mind.
I've been thinking about this more and more with each passing season. I've considered offering a discount to anglers who agree to never remove a fish from the water. I have no idea how that would be received. I've also considered building some kind of rectangular "net" or "box" or cradle in which the fish could be transferred to, in the water, for a scale photo. It would have a tape measure clearly visible. Perhaps the time has come.
Now I know I'm opening myself up here, but how about taking a giant step and saying, lets all just stop taking pictures of large fish that are going to be released? Not all fish, just those that need our protection. This won't fly with many, if not most, but it has to start somewhere. Remember when "catch and release" sounded like the dumbest idea on the planet? There was a time, when I was very young. Maybe its time for another dumb idea (limit photos) to start taking baby steps toward reality.
This ended up long, but I think its one of the most important issues facing fishermen now and in the future. There are more of us fishing the waters, with more knowledge and technology, and we're not gaining any more water or fish to my knowledge. And, its something we, as fishermen, CAN do something about without the need for crooked politicians or ignorant fish managers. It's in OUR hands! (and so are the gills and the slime!)
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